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benkloepfer
PopStar
Joined: Sep 02, 2004
Posts: 1042
Status: Offline
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  Posted:
Feb 28, 2005 - 03:23 PM |
 
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| Post subject: Prostitution or Pornography what is worse (or better)? |
Please take this post seriously. I honestly want to hear your opinions and not your humor. (ok, I enjoy the humor too but it tends to make people get off topic).
Regardless of what is legal and what is illegal (we all know that really doesn't matter what the laws are in most countries), it seems that in western countries pornography is easier to find and there is less of a taboo against it in comparison to prostitution.
Here in Shanghai, it seems to be the other way around, prostitutes are everywhere and don't seem to be hiding from anyone. Yet pornography is almost unheard of.
After noting these differences, I chalked it up to cultural difference and don't worry about it. Since I don't look at porn on a regular basis and I've never visited a prostitute (and don't plan on it), then this isn't an actual issue for me. Yet I can't help but wonder; what is the greater evil? and why does the degree of acceptability seem to be reversed when traveling from China to the US?
What do you think? |
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urgentculture
Rocker
Joined: Aug 19, 2003
Posts: 766
Status: Offline
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Feb 28, 2005 - 03:31 PM |
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That's a good question, I've thought about this also. What about Japan or Thailand --- do you find the same proportion of porn-to-prostitution? And what about the Netherlands? |
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frenchlover1999
Shanghai Royalty
Joined: Sep 18, 2004
Posts: 8730
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Feb 28, 2005 - 03:48 PM |
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Some ideas:
- Whats the use of porn if you have girls (whether hired or not)?
- Asian-style prostitutes are more appealing that the drug-addicts we see in the West
- I have noted that you have never seen porn, never been with a hooker, never touched yourself intentionally and you brush your teeth 3 times a day, good boy |
_________________
That was no shark. That was my personal submarine. But enough of this polite conversation. What is the purpose of your visit? |
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Studio@FH
Newbie
Joined: Feb 26, 2005
Posts: 6
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Feb 28, 2005 - 04:10 PM |
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so u r doing a research on this? or just try to finish ur PhD article like---The exposure of hidden spots in modern china?  |
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Amsterdamned
Squeeker
Joined: Feb 28, 2005
Posts: 10
Status: Offline
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Feb 28, 2005 - 04:48 PM |
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fl1999 wrote:<< Asian-style prostitutes are more appealing that the drug-addicts we see in the West >>
Although I'm not an expert in the field, I think prostitutes in the Netherlands don't fit in this category (the West). Off course, with the exception of illegal prostitutes.
For those of you interested, there are many rules and regulations to which prostitutes must abide, also (believe it or not) there is such a thing as a prostitute Union, that (obviously) stands up for the rights of legal prostitutes.
Again, I'm not an expert in the field and I've also never touched myself intentionally and what's this porn thing everyone talks about anyway...? |
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frenchlover1999
Shanghai Royalty
Joined: Sep 18, 2004
Posts: 8730
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Feb 28, 2005 - 05:13 PM |
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Yes you may be right. Obviously, as all of you here, I know nothing of those horrible things. |
_________________
That was no shark. That was my personal submarine. But enough of this polite conversation. What is the purpose of your visit? |
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WonderfulWorld
Raver
Joined: Feb 18, 2005
Posts: 380
Location: Xanghai, Xina
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Feb 28, 2005 - 05:37 PM |
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Yet I can't help but wonder; what is the greater evil? and why does the degree of acceptability seem to be reversed when traveling from China to the US?
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Your question is based on a false assumption. I'm Chinese and I watched porn from rented (well, "mis-rented", for the first time...) VHS when I was 11. I got caught one time by my grandparents but it was no big deal. They just asked me to promise not to watch such kind of things again. On the other hand, I've never thought of using the service of any prostitute or even wackress, no way. I'd rather keep funny itches away from my crotch.
The consumption of porn is not really stigmatized in China by "people in the street". In fact nobody (except the government) gives it a damn. But try touching a whore, and you are a loser forever. I checked with my Shanghainese friends and they totally agree with me, too. |
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frenchlover1999
Shanghai Royalty
Joined: Sep 18, 2004
Posts: 8730
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Feb 28, 2005 - 05:46 PM |
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Good one. Then who is touching the whores in all the KTVs, barbershops, saunas, shady hotels, etc? Those places are all so obvious in most residential areas (esp. barbershops). Maybe their only customers are foreigners and other migrant workers? Ah ah! |
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That was no shark. That was my personal submarine. But enough of this polite conversation. What is the purpose of your visit? |
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Edgewood
FooSlinger
Joined: Jan 28, 2004
Posts: 3909
Location: Colonial Shanghai
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Feb 28, 2005 - 06:04 PM |
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| But try touching a whore, and you are a loser forever. I checked with my Shanghainese friends and they totally agree with me, too. |
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Good one. Then who is touching the whores in all the KTVs, barbershops, saunas, shady hotels, etc? Those places are all so obvious in most residential areas (esp. barbershops). Maybe their only customers are foreigners and other migrant workers? Ah ah!
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Is it time to mention the 99.9% rule? |
_________________
Conlige suspectos semper habitos |
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good4kicks
LoopKicker
Joined: Jan 20, 2004
Posts: 955
Status: Offline
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Feb 28, 2005 - 06:22 PM |
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I think your question is not really valid.
Porn exists here but it's not out in the open like in the west. The Chinese also pretend that they don't have whorehouses but they are everywhere, just like the porn. These things are both around and are hidden behind a very thin facade of make believe.
The main difference between the west and China is that the Chinese pretend they don't have the evil scourges found in the west. Just like all the girls here pretend in front of their parents that they don't have boyfriends and are still virgins. I have met many Chinese that have told me "we don't have gays in China", which is one of the greatest jokes I have ever heard.
This is a nation of pretence. |
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WonderfulWorld
Raver
Joined: Feb 18, 2005
Posts: 380
Location: Xanghai, Xina
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Feb 28, 2005 - 06:40 PM |
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Chinese pretend they don't have the evil scourges found in the west. Just like all the girls here pretend in front of their parents that they don't have boyfriends and are still virgins. I have met many Chinese that have told me "we don't have gays in China", which is one of the greatest jokes I have ever heard.
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You said it!
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This is a nation of pretence.
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Some Western nations aren't any better. Let's have a look at the US (And some EU nations in the aspect of politics).
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Good one. Then who is touching the whores in all the KTVs, barbershops, saunas, shady hotels, etc? Those places are all so obvious in most residential areas (esp. barbershops). Maybe their only customers are foreigners and other migrant workers? Ah ah!
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They are loosers. They even have to pay for sex? The beatenest of the beaten! |
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DILLIGAF
LoopKicker
Joined: Dec 21, 2004
Posts: 799
Status: Offline
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Feb 28, 2005 - 06:56 PM |
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benkloepfer
PopStar
Joined: Sep 02, 2004
Posts: 1042
Status: Offline
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Feb 28, 2005 - 08:52 PM |
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Thanks for all the posts! As far as I can tell the concensus is that the chinese think prositution is worse than pornography. Which is pretty much the same view point held by western countries.
So maybe my question was based on an invalid assumption. But if that is true, then why does the government choose to crack down on this one special form of deviant behavior?
Wonderfulworld, you seem to have the insider's view here. Why do the police manage to keep porn from the public eye, yet they will walk right past a brothel and not blink an eye. Is it because the pornography ring doesn't pay the police for enough protection to be able to set-up a booth on the street?
If it is a financial question then it must mean that the chinese are less willing to buy porn than the westerners. Therefore the market isn't as strong as the prostitution market, which negates the view point that chinese see prositution as a greater evil than porn.[/quote] |
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Edgewood
FooSlinger
Joined: Jan 28, 2004
Posts: 3909
Location: Colonial Shanghai
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Feb 28, 2005 - 09:12 PM |
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| Is it because the pornography ring doesn't pay the police for enough protection to be able to set-up a booth on the street? |
They do [pay the filth], and there are [booths on the street]. |
_________________
Conlige suspectos semper habitos |
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urgentculture
Rocker
Joined: Aug 19, 2003
Posts: 766
Status: Offline
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Feb 28, 2005 - 09:53 PM |
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Come on, there's no question, it's much easier to find a whore here than it is to find porn. Much easier. I been approached to buy porn about 10 times in the last two years, but countless hookers wave at me daily.
How many people in Shanghai work in the skin trade? 100,000 ? No idea but it's a lot, and who cares if they're not paying taxes, that's a lot of people to keep off the unemployment line. Is it in the state's best interest to put them out of business?
But they don't look like American hookers, so tour busses drive by and never know. |
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lijunj
Reacher
Joined: Nov 18, 2002
Posts: 347
Location: Kerry Center,Shanghai
Status: Offline
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Feb 28, 2005 - 09:58 PM |
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Good questions, benkloepfer. I can't answer your questions. But I want to make some comments in you post.
Although these are all illegal in China. It seems these things are out of control here. I still remember a procuress was executed in Zhejiang Province just for prostitution related business 15 years ago. The government used execution to scare people at that period. They like to do whatever they want to. So don't be surprised next time that you'll get caught by Gong'an for holding a penthouse mag. . |
_________________
Your friend in Shanghai |
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WonderfulWorld
Raver
Joined: Feb 18, 2005
Posts: 380
Location: Xanghai, Xina
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Mar 01, 2005 - 02:36 AM |
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Because of book / data piracy, producers of porn get no revenue.
Porn hard to find? Go to any underground DVD shop and you'll find plenty of them. |
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benyu2004
Barker
Joined: June 29, 2004
Posts: 169
Status: Offline
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Mar 01, 2005 - 03:26 AM |
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As WFW said, there is no incentives to produce porn in China. You can get a live one in st easily, why u bother to watch a 2D one at home?
Prostitute is non-skill highly-paid occupation de facto here, plain and simple...don't u hear that they a required to pay for a special permmit and file income tax in many provinces/cities? |
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What I ask for the negro is not benevolence, not pity, not sympathy, but simply justice---Frederick Douglass |
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benkloepfer
PopStar
Joined: Sep 02, 2004
Posts: 1042
Status: Offline
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Mar 02, 2005 - 12:23 PM |
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So it has absolutely nothing to do with culture or morality.
But rather the absence of porn is only a by-product of rampant publication piracy and the over-abundance of prostitutes. Interesting!
It looks like you guys have come up with a pretty solid answer to my question. Thanks!
By the way "Studio @FH" -
No, I am not writing a doctoral thesis. And I'm not trying to point out something good or bad about chinese culture. If it had been a morality question, then it would have been a more interesting pursuit to find out what the cultural background for this phenomena is. But it turns out to be something much more mundane => finances.
Ben |
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