Best International Schools
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sbergman
Veejay
Joined: Sep 12, 2007
Posts: 2168
Status: Offline
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 Posted:
June 09, 2008 - 10:05 AM |
 
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| Quote: |
| we can bring the best of each educational philosophy to our kids at these 'international' schools. |
While that's a beautiful sentiment, I don't think it's practical or wise. An educational philosophy needs to be holistic and I don't think it's possible to combine, for example, the Singaporean or Korean philosophy of intense competition to spur hard work and striving with the more American philosophy (at least of the Alfie Kohn camp) of creating a safe space for creativity and cooperative work.
I don't think that the best thing is to cherry pick pieces of educational philosophies to create a mishmash of a program. I think it's best to develop a program that is informed by a single educational philosophy, be able to honestly and effectively communicate your school's philosophy, and let families choose the school that is most in concert with their convictions. |
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sbergman
Veejay
Joined: Sep 12, 2007
Posts: 2168
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June 09, 2008 - 10:13 AM |
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StMichael, I think that at your school, displaying edited work is in keeping with the Singaporean educational philosophy and therefore very appropriate. At my school, creativity is central to our program (and to our marketing message) so we have more leeway to display works in progress. |
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StMichael
Ranter
Joined: Feb 19, 2005
Posts: 586
Location: Qibao, Shanghai
Status: Offline
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June 09, 2008 - 10:18 AM |
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You're the guy who markets the school in the States, if I do not remember wrongly? 
Each educational philosophy brings with it strengths and weaknesses. I remember telling some of my friends from the States (who lamented on problems with their educational system) that the US produces a lot of artists, a lot of entrepreneurs and is a place where a plumber is considered a good trade. Singaporeans may be valued as good engineers (this now eclipsed by the rise of China and India) and managers (we are capable of producing very good systems), but our educational system handicaps us when we want to produce what the States can produce.
What I really cannot understand, though, is why a teacher would join a school espousing a certain educational system, but refuse to abide by its philosophies and system. To me, it is important that I agree with the system. If I cannot I should move on to another system - but until then I should abide by the philosophies until my contract expires. |
_________________
Michael Chan www.senseimichael.com |
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sbergman
Veejay
Joined: Sep 12, 2007
Posts: 2168
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June 09, 2008 - 10:33 AM |
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Agreed with a few exceptions: I can see rebellion if a teacher is stuck in a public system with limited employment alternatives and sees himself as trying to change the ethos of the system. I can also see it being a problem when a school isn't completely honest about its mission at hiring time. (SMIC is a great school on many fronts but I know that there are teachers there who feel that there was no honest disclosure about the school's Christian mission at hiring and who have felt the need then to rebel against that ethos.) |
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sbergman
Veejay
Joined: Sep 12, 2007
Posts: 2168
Status: Offline
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June 09, 2008 - 10:34 AM |
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Agreed, with a few exceptions: I can see rebellion if a teacher is stuck in a public system with limited employment alternatives and sees himself as trying to change the ethos of the system. I can also see it being a problem when a school isn't completely honest about its mission at hiring time. (SMIC is a great school on many fronts but I know that there are teachers there who feel that there was no honest disclosure about the school's Christian mission at hiring and who have felt the need then to rebel against that ethos.) |
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StMichael
Ranter
Joined: Feb 19, 2005
Posts: 586
Location: Qibao, Shanghai
Status: Offline
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June 09, 2008 - 10:37 AM |
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There is a reason why Singaporean teachers leave the Singapore educational system, to try others. Why any teacher would have limited employment alternatives is really beyond me.
And honest disclosure is very important indeed. One of the items I always speak about during the interview (whether with teachers or with parents) is the Singaporean educational system. The administration, to attract teachers who can align with its philosophies, must be upfront about the philosophies.
I have always thought, though, that SMIC was pretty open about its Christian mission. My first encounter with the school was its Christian mission! |
_________________
Michael Chan www.senseimichael.com |
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hautumncloud
LoopKicker
Joined: Nov 04, 2006
Posts: 912
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| Posted:
June 09, 2008 - 10:39 AM |
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| sbergman wrote: |
| StMichael, I think that at your school, displaying edited work is in keeping with the Singaporean educational philosophy and therefore very appropriate. At my school, creativity is central to our program (and to our marketing message) so we have more leeway to display works in progress. |
bergie, was waiting for you to respond to this thread! Glad you did.
| Quote: |
StMichael
Posted: June 09, 2008 - 10:18 AM
---------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------
You're the guy who markets the school in the States, if I do not remember wrongly?
Each educational philosophy brings with it strengths and weaknesses. I remember telling some of my friends from the States (who lamented on problems with their educational system) that the US produces a lot of artists, a lot of entrepreneurs and is a place where a plumber is considered a good trade. Singaporeans may be valued as good engineers (this now eclipsed by the rise of China and India) and managers (we are capable of producing very good systems), but our educational system handicaps us when we want to produce what the States can produce.
What I really cannot understand, though, is why a teacher would join a school espousing a certain educational system, but refuse to abide by its philosophies and system. To me, it is important that I agree with the system. If I cannot I should move on to another system - but until then I should abide by the philosophies until my contract expires.
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St Mike, you have one of them rebels in your school too? LOL! I think it would be productive to agree and go towards the philosophy of the school that you are teaching in but not lose sight of the personal touch and being open minded. You seem quite open minded and can explore into quite a few discussions here outside of the typical Singaporean "kiasuness" philosopy . However, since you are in admin, you actually can in many ways be more effective in reaching the students than just at teaching levels. It is the bigger, long term picture than the immediate effect that would make a huge difference. Slowly but surely.... |
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StMichael
Ranter
Joined: Feb 19, 2005
Posts: 586
Location: Qibao, Shanghai
Status: Offline
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June 09, 2008 - 10:41 AM |
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hautumncloud,
I suspect there are such teachers in *every* school - even in Singapore! 
Yeah, slowly but surely indeed... |
_________________
Michael Chan www.senseimichael.com |
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hautumncloud
LoopKicker
Joined: Nov 04, 2006
Posts: 912
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June 09, 2008 - 10:47 AM |
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| sbergman wrote: |
| Agreed, with a few exceptions: I can see rebellion if a teacher is stuck in a public system with limited employment alternatives and sees himself as trying to change the ethos of the system. I can also see it being a problem when a school isn't completely honest about its mission at hiring time. (SMIC is a great school on many fronts but I know that there are teachers there who feel that there was no honest disclosure about the school's Christian mission at hiring and who have felt the need then to rebel against that ethos.) |
When I first come to read about SMIC, I knew right off that it is a Christian school with a Christian mission. However, that they promote creativity is new to me. I thought SMIC was very academically inclined with loads of homework. We did not get to visit the school though because of the location. |
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sbergman
Veejay
Joined: Sep 12, 2007
Posts: 2168
Status: Offline
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June 09, 2008 - 11:04 AM |
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SMIC is not the school I work for - although I do think SMIC has a good deal of creativity. As StMichael mentioned, I work for a boarding school in the US. I did not pick up on the Christian thing at SMIC, until my kids were there. It was never a big deal for me (my kids are used to being in the minority) but I know that some people are not as okay with it. |
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88807
Lurker
Joined: Oct 15, 2004
Posts: 31
Status: Offline
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June 09, 2008 - 12:08 PM |
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We dont have that mentaility where I come from. Parents are more process oriented. |
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ZIP200120
Newbie
Joined: June 06, 2008
Posts: 3
Status: Offline
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June 10, 2008 - 10:01 AM |
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StMitchael wrote
This is especially so for Asian parents (I am generalising!) and especially for private schools, whether for-profit or not-for-profit.
The showcase mentality can never be avoided. When a parent walks through the corridors, she instinctively looks for certain indications to the school's culture, the school's "production" and the quality of the teaching. The school (or class) that does the "showcase" properly has an advantage. "
Do Asian parents care more about their kid? No. All parents care about their kids not just "Asian" parents. Does Singapore count as Asia? Yes. Why in this forum we keep mention "Asian" kids, "Asian" parents? Are we talking about International school or Western school?
We show most progress kids's subjects, so we can encourage them. Does all education system should do this way or just have perfect showcase for foreign parent? |
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ZIP200120
Newbie
Joined: June 06, 2008
Posts: 3
Status: Offline
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June 10, 2008 - 10:19 AM |
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Hautumncloud
Wrote
And no one is "trying to counter you". Pathetic that this is your first post and it is coming across this way. Even scarier to think that you actually may be representing SHSID in whatever position.
If you are talking about my comments about ZIP, No, I was NOT commenting on your typos. Reread again. I was commenting on your comment below if you are the same ZIP id. Hmmm, quite a big differnece from absolutely no puntuation by ZIP to the post by 88807
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Please do not point each other in this forum, I just joined this “International “ forum. |
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StMichael
Ranter
Joined: Feb 19, 2005
Posts: 586
Location: Qibao, Shanghai
Status: Offline
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| Posted:
June 10, 2008 - 09:01 PM |
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| ZIP200120 wrote: |
StMitchael wrote
This is especially so for Asian parents (I am generalising!) and especially for private schools, whether for-profit or not-for-profit.
The showcase mentality can never be avoided. When a parent walks through the corridors, she instinctively looks for certain indications to the school's culture, the school's "production" and the quality of the teaching. The school (or class) that does the "showcase" properly has an advantage. "
Do Asian parents care more about their kid? No. All parents care about their kids not just "Asian" parents. Does Singapore count as Asia? Yes. Why in this forum we keep mention "Asian" kids, "Asian" parents? Are we talking about International school or Western school?
We show most progress kids's subjects, so we can encourage them. Does all education system should do this way or just have perfect showcase for foreign parent? |
I read your response to my quote, and pardon my lack of intelligence...but I really cannot see what you are trying to reply to? Would you mind enlightening me a little? |
_________________
Michael Chan www.senseimichael.com |
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elainelge
Lurker
Joined: June 11, 2008
Posts: 20
Status: Offline
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June 12, 2008 - 03:28 PM |
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Hi - I am trying to locate the Xie He school website but have not been successful. Any ideas? |
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RSussman
Newbie
Joined: June 12, 2008
Posts: 1
Status: Offline
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June 12, 2008 - 09:54 PM |
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| Post subject: Fudan International School |
| fuyu_jinjin wrote: |
| can anyone give me some comments about Fudan International High school? |
Hi! I'm the Acting Director of Fudan International School. We're very small, but growing. We're trying to build on Fudan's reputation of academic excellence to create a school with the highest possible expectations for all our students (and faculty).
The international division itself is quite new--this is only our second year in operation--but thanks to our partnership with Fudan Fuzhong (one of the most prestigious high schools in China), we have access to all of the resources of a long-established school: incredible science labs, performance spaces, sports fields, etc. Sharing a campus with such motivated, bright Chinese students doesn't hurt either!
Our faculty is a mix of older & more experienced teachers and relatively young graduates from top colleges (Yale is particularly well-represented, but we also have Harvard, Princeton, Duke, Middlebury...). Our students are currently about 80% Asian (Japan, Korea, Hong Kong, etc.) and 20% American, Canadian, UK, etc.
Our curriculum is decidedly American in style, with AP classes offered in grades 10-12. We also have three ESOL levels in middle school (beginning, intermediate, and advanced) and high school (low intermediate, high intermediate, advanced) which students move through before joining native speakers in the regular English track.
Our administration is dedicated to the idea of creating a top international school that nonetheless has strong ties to the Chinese academic community surrounding us.
One other advantage is that our tuition is fairly low compared to many of the other international schools; Fudan is not trying to make much of a profit with this new venture (and won't for some time!), but rather is trying to enhance its international reputation and exposure.
We're open for grades 1 - 12 this fall! |
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Rave
Newbie
Joined: June 12, 2008
Posts: 2
Status: Offline
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June 12, 2008 - 10:06 PM |
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| Post subject: SHSID |
Hello. I went through the hassle of creating an account on this forum with a fake email address simply to address this issue.
SHSID - Is, put elegantly; not the greatest school in this bustling city. Do not fall victim to the seduction of the "mere" 45000RMB tuition fee. True, it is relatively/signifigantly lower than that of other international schools however-it should also serve as a ratio to reflect the quality of it's education. If you were to ask the students in the school of their opinion of the school, the vast majority would reply that they are satisfied. For they do not know better. The institution is ran like business. A very shitty one at that. It in all probablity one of the highest turnover rates in the world. No exaggeration. I'm talking about a 50%+ turnover rate. A beneficial side to that is - when the "foreign" teachers leave, they take their grade books and records with them. Allowing the administration to modify the grades to seem all the more "normal". This is where 20 year old caucasian college graduates flock to earn their paycheck. The students are wronged. They walk out of this school thinking they know what they need to go on but they do not. For those of you who are wondering,I fully understand the severity of my statement. I'm posting this because I can no longer watch it go on. There must be change. People need to know.I figured this was a start.
For practical purposes, take screenshots of this. For this post, my account, and my fake email address may all magically vanish if things go downhill.
P.S Many students speak English fluently and think critically. The masses are Asians, but they hail from various English speaking countries U.S.A, Canada, England, Australia, etc.
- Rave |
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88807
Lurker
Joined: Oct 15, 2004
Posts: 31
Status: Offline
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June 17, 2008 - 07:54 AM |
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Rave, SHSID isn't a perfect school, none of them are.
Universities and schools in many other countries, are run on the basis that their foreign intake of students help to subsidize their local students. This is a common model in government funded institutions. There are also many schools run like businesses. Having said that, Im not really sure why you would say why SHSID is "run like a business" and what that actually means. Teachers have access to all the materials they need, decent text books etc. One foreign owned school i worked at in Shanghai (it really was run like a business) was so tight with its money teachers were paper rationed, and were only issued a certain number of white board markers a term!
Staff turnover rate is high at SHSID. That is because the fees are lower than other schools, and they have to hire a contingent of young teachers to keep their huge foreign staff at the required level. They do have a core of experienced teachers each year. Staff turn over has its positives to, there are constantly new ideas coming into the school. They are also a government run school, and paying the salaries of some western (private) schools is not an option.
Teachers at SHSID have to enter grades and comments into a central computer system, like most other decent schools, and so they cant take their marks with them. These teachers marks are password protected etc. On very rare occasions, subject to meetings and discussion with teachers, grades are reviewed. All schools I've worked at in Australia and in China (both Chinese and international), reserve that right.
Most students are happy with the school because it's a pretty good school. The seniors getting into all the "top" universities, both here and in the "west". Teachers are left to do their thing without micro management, and despite being a government school, slowly some new ideas have been adopted based on suggestions from expatriate staff. Change always happens slowly in a government setting though, and one must be aware of that. |
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msittig
Rocker
Joined: Oct 06, 2004
Posts: 733
Location: Zhangjiang High-Tech Park
Status: Offline
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| Posted:
June 17, 2008 - 10:43 AM |
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| Post subject: Re: Fudan International School |
| RSussman wrote: |
| Hi! I'm the Acting Director of Fudan International School. |
Hi and welcome to Shanghai Expat! It's great to have another int'l school representative around here to answer questions and clear up misconceptions about schools in Shanghai.
| Rave wrote: |
| SHSID - Is, put elegantly; not the greatest school in this bustling city. |
Hi Rave! May I ask what perspective you criticize the school from? Are you a current/former teacher? A student or parent? I know that anonymity is safer, but identifying your relationship with the school would add some credibility to your criticisms. As it stands now, your comments don't really mean much. |
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Hi Charlotte! |
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msittig
Rocker
Joined: Oct 06, 2004
Posts: 733
Location: Zhangjiang High-Tech Park
Status: Offline
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| Posted:
June 17, 2008 - 10:50 AM |
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| elainelge wrote: |
| Hi - I am trying to locate the Xie He school website but have not been successful. Any ideas? |
This one? http://www.xieheedu.com/
Also, Concordia's Chinese name is Xiehe: http://www.ciss.com.cn/ |
_________________
Hi Charlotte! |
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elainelge
Lurker
Joined: June 11, 2008
Posts: 20
Status: Offline
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June 18, 2008 - 05:07 PM |
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Hi Thank you for the website, alas, I cannot afford them FEES at Concordia or any other international school for that matter. SHSID only starts from Yer 4 I think and Fudan is a bit far? So far I keep running around in the PingHe / SMIC / Gold Apple circle with no other options except for home schooling. Sigh! |
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StMichael
Ranter
Joined: Feb 19, 2005
Posts: 586
Location: Qibao, Shanghai
Status: Offline
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June 18, 2008 - 06:36 PM |
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And homeschooling is pretty tough, frankly speaking. I really take my hat off to my wife for her dedication to what she believes is her vision from God.
I think 88807 should be able to answer with greater certainty, but I believe SHSID is opening up the other grades levels as well? |
_________________
Michael Chan www.senseimichael.com |
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elainelge
Lurker
Joined: June 11, 2008
Posts: 20
Status: Offline
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June 18, 2008 - 06:46 PM |
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yes I think your wife must be a super woman! I have written to her and said that I will contact her when I get there. I will wait for 88807 to reply. hopefully something comes up. Otherwise I'm thinking some private tutoring from Jan to Aug 2009 and Pinghe or SMIC in Sept 2009. |
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88807
Lurker
Joined: Oct 15, 2004
Posts: 31
Status: Offline
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June 19, 2008 - 08:17 PM |
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Hi elainelge. SHSID has grades 1-3 at our Pudong campus, and we are starting grade 3 here at the puxi campus next school year |
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xinli
Newbie
Joined: Feb 25, 2008
Posts: 3
Status: Offline
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| Posted:
June 20, 2008 - 12:09 PM |
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| Post subject: Questions about SSIS |
Konnichiwa Michael Sensei  ,
I am looking for a school for my daughter where (the order is the importance)
1. They English and Chinese are taught by native speakers
2. They have an ESL program for non-native English speaker
(She is Japanese-Chinese, and her father is British).
3. The teaching style is more focused on students' creativity, and free thinking,
encouraging students to have their own views and opinions. Not so much
emphasis on pushing to just get high scores on tests.
4.Besides academic study, some after-class activities like sports, music, arts, etc.
(She likes swimming, running, skating, piano, and drawing)
I know we can't get all we want, but so far I found SSIS can satisfy most of these
and Yew Chung Int's teaches both English and Chinese, too.
Here are my questions,
1. Does SSIS really teach Chinese well? Because I saw a post saying—
SSIS is a good option if your child’s English is reasonable, and you aren't interested
in your child learning Chinese. Their Chinese program isn't very good and they don’t stream classes--
2. Does SSIS really teach English well? I saw another message saying—
They have a very limited program that gets kids to a very
basic level of English, and then dumps them into classes with native speakers. SSIS saps kids
confidence by giving all kids the same standard tests. It also provides no additional support for
kids struggling with English. So why accept kids with low English levels?--
What do you think ??
Thanks very much – I would very appreciate hearing back from you. |
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