Best International Schools
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StMichael
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Joined: Feb 19, 2005
Posts: 582
Location: Qibao, Shanghai
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 Posted:
June 28, 2008 - 08:17 PM |
 
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The problem is with how we define success. Singapore is an extremely competitive and stressful society, where success is often measured by material gains. Under such situations, being a chef or a plumber is considered "lowly". I like to remind my Singaporean pupils (back when I used to teach in Singapore) that plumbers in England are haughty. They earn big bucks, and nobody dares to offend them (unless you want him to tell ALL his plumber friends about you - try to get one to service you the next time).
There really is a price we Singaporeans pay for our "success". Perhaps the benefits of a nation where there's no estate taxes, no capital gains taxes, income taxes of barely 22% max, and VAT of only 7%...would that be considered a good price to pay? |
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Michael Chan www.senseimichael.com |
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New gal
Newbie
Joined: July 01, 2008
Posts: 7
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July 02, 2008 - 01:59 PM |
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wondering which school is suitable for my 2.5 yrs old kid
had checked with SMIC, the staffs told me even the waiting list for yr 08/09 is FULL.... and i have to queue in Dec08 for next year (Sep09) admission  which means my child has to stop school for a year?!!
can someone pls advise me on this? is there any school which accept students after Sep'08, after the school term starts?
thanks folks! |
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caramello
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Joined: Apr 17, 2008
Posts: 70
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July 04, 2008 - 11:59 AM |
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SMIC is an American school right? Maybe a little more information might help folks give you a good answer. Do you only want American curriculum that kinda thing  |
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New gal
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Joined: July 01, 2008
Posts: 7
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July 05, 2008 - 12:44 PM |
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i have no preference for curriculum.... most important is to find a school which teaches most subjects in english, and english must be the 1st language.... any recommendation? |
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StMichael
Ranter
Joined: Feb 19, 2005
Posts: 582
Location: Qibao, Shanghai
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July 05, 2008 - 12:55 PM |
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I suggest you give a call to the Shanghai Singapore International School in late August, when the Pre-School Heads are back. I believe the Xuhui campus will be opening a Pre-Nursery class. |
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Michael Chan www.senseimichael.com |
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caramello
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Joined: Apr 17, 2008
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July 15, 2008 - 10:31 PM |
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I don't know if that's a good price to pay or not really...i don't feel qualified to judge it. I think i was more bothered about what was happening in England to be honest. We've just got back from there and an article was talking again about getting rid of the long summer holidays to help working families. I just don't think that will help the children though and i also (and i KNOW this is very traditional) don't always think that both parents being at work all the time is great. I am not saying both parents shouldn't work at all but the emphasis on work work work now seems extreme. I just have such happy memories of the summer holidays and think it would be a terrible shame to lose them. And if it was imported over here as the British type schools followed suit that would be a huge shame...not sure if they would though or not |
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StMichael
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Joined: Feb 19, 2005
Posts: 582
Location: Qibao, Shanghai
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July 16, 2008 - 10:04 AM |
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It would be a "logical" thing to do, getting rid of the summer holidays in the light of the new demographic profile. The summer holidays used to be there also for a reason - in the Agricultural Age, the children were needed back at home to help out in the fields, and they still do so in China. In this Information Age, they are not really needed.
But goodness! The children need a break! A time to hang loose, and learn things they do not usually learn in school! They need to learn from the School of Life too! |
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Michael Chan www.senseimichael.com
Last edited by StMichael on July 16, 2008 - 03:39 PM; edited 1 time in total |
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hautumncloud
LoopKicker
Joined: Nov 04, 2006
Posts: 910
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July 16, 2008 - 03:29 PM |
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I think this is opening a big can of worms. This topic has been debated passionately in Canada and now there are even quite a few government funded schools in Toronto area which offer "all year round schooling" with short breaks of two weeks with every ten weeks of lessons. It did not do well in our area since many of our residents move up to their cottage in the summer for the whole 2 months (with the working dad commuting to work or on modified work-from home). But the idea was greatly accepted mainly by working parents to eliminate baby sitting problem for the whole 2 months summer vacation and the difficulty to compete among colleagues to take vacation time during the summer + paying high prices through the nose for any trips planned in this high season.
Then there is the debate that school was formed for the convenience of working parents especially kindergarten where moms need to put their children somewhere while they worked. Also some think that school is an institution and questioned if at all children need to learn academically in an "institution" settings.
Its very interesting to hear both sides of the debate and quite educating to find out how school came about in the first place. I once sat in and listened with great interest from a group of homeschooling parents defending their choices.
I am just glad that I have my children with me over the summer and enjoy spending time with them not rushing to any scheduled routine. |
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bodkinvanhorn
Newbie
Joined: July 30, 2008
Posts: 2
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July 30, 2008 - 11:26 AM |
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We may/may not (argh!) be relocating to Shanghai from Singapore in January and were curious about schools. We currently live in Singapore where my kids go to a British-based school, although we're American.
I've been scrolling through this thread looking for information about Shanghai Community International School - On the website it appealed to me most, although I know from experience that things can be very different in real life.
Concordia also seemed appealing, but does it teach religion? I am okay with it being based on Christian principals, but not the actual teaching of Chrisianity as The One Religion. If they teach World Religion from an academic angle I'm okay with that, too.
How about Dulwich? Is it too teddibly teddibly British? I don't know how long we'll stay in China but I don't want them to have to deal with O/A levels. Although they're in younger grades (aged 12,  they are both interested in IB diplomas, which they're on track for currently. |
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bodkinvanhorn
Newbie
Joined: July 30, 2008
Posts: 2
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July 30, 2008 - 11:27 AM |
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I guess that smiley face was the result of the number eight followed by a parenthese. Second kid is 8. |
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Silver Path
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Joined: July 31, 2008
Posts: 10
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July 31, 2008 - 04:38 PM |
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Dear New Gal,
If you are still looking for an excellent Preschool I would recommend Tiny Tots International Pre-school and Kindergarten with whom I am a manager and with hand on heart can readily say that in my humble opinion this is a fantastic environment where I am looking forward to sending my own son when he is old enough..
A quick description: Over the past 26 years, Tiny Tots has established a solid curriculum with an international focus delivered by caring and experienced teachers. The Sequential Step System academic program is an age specific program optimized for small groups of children. The average age range within each year-group is no more than 13 months. This ensures that your child’s social, physical, and cognitive development progresses at an age appropriate level. Small class sizes and great adult to child ratios are essential in order to acknowledge the daily achievements of each child. Tiny Tots also has an integrated Chinese language program as well as a broad extracurricular program. All activities are conducted within a safe, loving environment enabling kids at Tiny Tots to grow in confidence, happiness, and success.
Address: #50 Gu Mei Road,Minhang,201102.
Phone: 6480-8933
Fax: 6480-8948
Address: #43 Fuxing West Road, 200031
Phone: 6431-3788
Fax: 6433-2468
E-Mail: tinytotssg@hotmail.com
URL: www.tinytots.com.cn |
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StMichael
Ranter
Joined: Feb 19, 2005
Posts: 582
Location: Qibao, Shanghai
Status: Offline
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Aug 03, 2008 - 10:06 PM |
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Sigh...I am suddenly and seriously in need of a grade 3 school teacher (teaching English, Math and Science) and not having any luck with the recruitment channels (this late in the recruitment year and so on...).
If you guys know of anyone who's interested, please get them to PM me! I need licensed teachers (Bachelor of Education), not a TESL teacher, as we are doing grade school here, not a language centre.
Thank you! |
_________________
Michael Chan www.senseimichael.com |
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che8
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Joined: Aug 21, 2008
Posts: 14
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Aug 21, 2008 - 11:24 AM |
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Hi all. Hope you have found your Grade 3 teacher StMichael.
Was researching on most of the schools in SH for our two kids incl. reviewing all posts for the past two days just to get an idea of others' thoughts on schools, etc. A friend of mine has just moved to Shanghai recently and placed her kids at YCIS because she wanted to have them improve on what little Mandarin they have. I have the same objective. It will be a waste being in China with so much resources available to learn the language and yet not. She hopes our kids will join hers. I have decided not to and chose to enrol our kids to SSIS. One of her feedback was that SSIS have far too many Asian kids and besides Mandarin as her criteria, she wanted them to have the 'international' exposure i.e western kids around.
Why am I choosing SSIS? Too many Asian kids in there? Not a problem. A plus for us. Our kids (Asian mom + Western dad) will I hope by this factor be fully immerse into the Mandarin language. You can say 'No room for escape'. They are now at the American International School in GZ. Pretty good school except for the fact that since everyone speaks English there, they just find it easier to just communicate in English and not bother with their Mandarin. Re 'international' as in western exposure - there are plenty of friends at the Racquet Club nearby and my kids are pretty sociable kids.
In defense to your school. Any curriculum can almost always be offered by all schools and often met. However I am choosing your school not based only on curriculum but based on the schools idealogy, teaching methods and perhaps on your teachers.
I have lots of Singaporean friends and almost all of them speaks really good Mandarin and really good English and that's coming from once being schooled at their home country. In terms of regimented teaching and homework - this teaches discipline in part, responsibility to learn in part and hopefully motivation to improve learning. The Singaporeans I know are also proud of their identity and every single one of them, when given a task will put their very best to deliver what they promised and even more. Why, simply for the fact that their work do reflect them personally as a person and as a Singaporean. Intelligence - look at Singapore thriving economy and international exposure. People skills are really good too, they get along with practically any nationality. If this roughly decribe your school culture, then I am sure that my kids will learn ' confidence and pride in their work', 'respect to others', 'responsibility', 'discipline' and best of all, they get to converse in English and Mandarin naturally, all in one sentence. |
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catur
Talker
Joined: Feb 16, 2005
Posts: 108
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Aug 21, 2008 - 11:50 AM |
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| Post subject: SHSID -- NO!! |
| 88807 wrote: |
xinli, I know your message was posted to St M., but I can help a little as I once taught at SSIS, but I have moved to SHSID.
When I was there, SSIS operated with an 'immersion' approach- ESL class, then after that all the kids together. That aside, the English text books they use are really good, and there's a lot to be said for the place. I think their textbooks are better than the US ones used at SHSID. St M. can comment about the Chinese program, I think it changed after I left.
SHSID might be an option to. We have different streamed grades of English as well as ESL (ESL, then O level, then O+, then 'native O and native A'. It means your child can work her/his way up through various levels). English is taught by native speakers, and the Chinese program (being a Chinese school) is taught by locals and is a Chinese syllabus.
I think though both SSIS and SHSID are very academic, which is both a strength and a weakness. From what I have heard, both SSIS and SHSID have a much higher standard of maths and science than almost any other 'international/overseas' schools, but they don't emphasize creativity as much. They are very "asian" schools. |
I strongly disagree that SHSID is an academic school, at least for the 1 year that my 2 children (grade 5 and 9) attended. I was very disappointed, and feel they fell back about a half grade in learning. They never seemed to have homework, and the general courses (except English) were mostly (not all) taught by locals, whose lack of English proficiiency was oft pointed out by my children in humorous examples. They had attended SAS and Concordia (both fine) for 5 years, and are transferring to SMIC this year. I got the feeling that SHSID was milking the foreigners for high tuition, giving back a mediocre education at best, and using the "profits" to fund their Chinese school. |
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ShanghaiInitiative
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Joined: Aug 21, 2008
Posts: 14
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Aug 21, 2008 - 03:23 PM |
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What is the best way to apply as an expat for these international schools? Is going through the school the best option?
Can someone tell me of any international schools that will hire someone with an MBA degree? I have a Psychology degree, marketing diploma, and MBA degree. I also teach at university in South Korea.
I appreciate any feedback you have regarding schools that I should contact or avoid.
Thanks |
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msittig
Rocker
Joined: Oct 06, 2004
Posts: 733
Location: Zhangjiang High-Tech Park
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Aug 21, 2008 - 03:49 PM |
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The best way to apply to a school in order of "bestness" is:
1) Through a friend who works there.
2) At a recruiting fair.
3) Applying directly to the school.
I'm not going to suggests any schools to avoid because I am biased towards the school at which I teach (SMIC), and want to stay on collegial relations with my fellow educators I can recommend SMIC for a few reasons, which you can learn by PM-ing me.
EDIT: I also want to add that with an MBA you would probably be an excellent candidate for recruitment/admissions or career counselling at a school. So you might want to consider those positions before/in addition to applying as a teacher. |
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Hi Charlotte! |
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ShanghaiInitiative
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Joined: Aug 21, 2008
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Aug 21, 2008 - 04:02 PM |
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Thanks Msittig,
That's great that you represent SMIC, and I look forward to hearing your opinions about your school. I have heard good things about your school so it's wonderful to hear more.
Question: Would you say that the more MBA-suited rolls of recruitment/admissions or career counselling pay as well as teacher salaries? Do they give expat contracts which include housing and other perks? To be honest I don't know much about that aspect of the job market in China.
If anyone else from other schools has comments I'd love to hear them. I'm curious about schools like:
SHSID
SMIC
YCIS
SAS
Livingstone
YKPao
If any representatives from those schools would like to share information I'm very open to hearing all different perspectives on this topic.
Thanks. |
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msittig
Rocker
Joined: Oct 06, 2004
Posts: 733
Location: Zhangjiang High-Tech Park
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Aug 21, 2008 - 04:43 PM |
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I PM-ed you with my comments. Unfortunately salaries at SMIC are covered by an NDA, so I can't tell you much about them. It's one of the quirks of working at a tech-company school. |
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Hi Charlotte! |
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ShanghaiInitiative
Squeeker
Joined: Aug 21, 2008
Posts: 14
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Aug 21, 2008 - 07:43 PM |
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Msittig,
Is it common for many schools to not disclose salaries or even a rough idea of what the wages are? |
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StMichael
Ranter
Joined: Feb 19, 2005
Posts: 582
Location: Qibao, Shanghai
Status: Offline
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Aug 21, 2008 - 08:13 PM |
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Thank you, che8. I am still at the interviewing process (3 candidates so far), as I do not wish to make hasty decisions. My pupil's future is at stake here, and I do not wish to grab any Tom, Dick or Harry to teach. It is frustrating seeing the tons of people with no educational qualifications try their luck and send me their resumes. Which part of "Bachelors in Education" do they not understand? Oh boy.
One of the clients that came to my campus asked me a "cheeky" question, "If there is something bad about SSIS, what would you say it is? No school is perfect!" I paused and answered frankly, "The Singapore curriculum is very stressful. I have come across many crying kids in my 8 years as a teacher." That client never returned. I hope my boss doesn't hang me for losing that client!
ShanghaiInitiative,
My school does not disclose salaries, and yes, we are not allowed to disclose our salaries too. I do not think this salary thing is a matter of tech-company, Micah, but a Chinese-Taiwanese-Singaporean thing.
With an MBA, and without an education degree, you are likely to only be able to teach at the Senior High level, perhaps in Business Management or Economics. Try for this route. |
_________________
Michael Chan www.senseimichael.com |
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msittig
Rocker
Joined: Oct 06, 2004
Posts: 733
Location: Zhangjiang High-Tech Park
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Aug 21, 2008 - 08:43 PM |
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| Quote: |
| My school does not disclose salaries, and yes, we are not allowed to disclose our salaries too. I do not think this salary thing is a matter of tech-company, Micah, but a Chinese-Taiwanese-Singaporean thing. |
Hmm, I didn't think of that. It's too bad because I think a lot of prospective teachers like to look at a school's website and see the payscale listed, like at SAS, Concordia, etc.
http://www.saschina.org/jobs/emp_faqs.asp (used to have a scale, now only max/min)
http://www.ciss.com.cn/Employment/Benefits_and_Salary
http://www.dcshanghai.cn/Portals/2/Download/Employment_Opportunities/s alary%20and%20benefits%20package.pdf
Still, I guess it's pretty typical to not disclose the salary. Of the eight or so schools whose websites I checked, only the above three had even simple ranges. They'll make you go through the interview before deciding whether to make you an offer, and only then would you know. I'm not sure about NDAs, that'd be in the contract... |
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Hi Charlotte! |
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StMichael
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Joined: Feb 19, 2005
Posts: 582
Location: Qibao, Shanghai
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Aug 21, 2008 - 08:50 PM |
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I would love to find out too! Rather than apply and waste my time when I find out that the salary offered is way disgusting, if you get what I mean. |
_________________
Michael Chan www.senseimichael.com |
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hautumncloud
LoopKicker
Joined: Nov 04, 2006
Posts: 910
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Aug 21, 2008 - 10:24 PM |
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^^ Salary is a very private matter for everyone although I have to say I have been asked point blank in China how much I earn! If I were working for your school (or any organization for that matter) I would much much prefer that my salary not be revealed. On this part of the Chinese culture, I have not and know that I will never get over it. |
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StMichael
Ranter
Joined: Feb 19, 2005
Posts: 582
Location: Qibao, Shanghai
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Aug 21, 2008 - 10:30 PM |
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I know - I find salary a private matter too, but a disclosure of expected salary or the salary scale would be nice, when a company sends out recruitment notices. |
_________________
Michael Chan www.senseimichael.com |
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ShanghaiInitiative
Squeeker
Joined: Aug 21, 2008
Posts: 14
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Aug 22, 2008 - 12:30 AM |
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In business a company often says "please indicate your expected salary".
This serves 2 purposes for the company during hiring.
1) It identifies how you value your abilities. If management has decided they are willing to spend between say $50,000-$56,000 USD and you say you will work for $30,000 then it means you don't value your own skills or you are unfamiliar with the market you are entering. Most likely you won't be chosen.
2) Same scenario and the company considers you a potential qualified applicant and the salary you demand is $48,000. They then try to sign the most coveted applicant within the salary range by offering the low end of the pay range. If the coveted applicant is much stronger than you, they will accept him for $56,000 if that is as low as he will go. However, if the coveted applicant is not much stronger than you, then they will offer closer to $50,000 (the low end of the range) and if the applicant pushes for more they will most likely come to you and offer you the $48,000 and then the department comes in under-budget and the hiring manager probably gets a tiny bonus.
I believe the reverse should be true and schools should tell their salaries so that teachers know who they want to apply for based on who is compensating appropriately. However, the schools also don't publish because they fear the overall quality of their teachers will be perceived as in a direct relationship to the salaries paid. Which by the way, is often times closely related to the tuition fees that are charged by the school.
Parents of SAS students like to know that SAS teachers are paid the most so that they feel confident SAS is recruiting the highest quality teachers. The point goes that higher wages attract better talent, and therefore parents feel more comfortable dropping huge tuition fees since they have some type of quantitative proof that their money is being well-spent.
The darn schools have us by the balls. |
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