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good4kicks
LoopKicker
Joined: Jan 20, 2004
Posts: 955
Status: Offline
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July 16, 2004 - 02:53 PM |
 
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| Post subject: What is wrong with mainland Chinese? |
Some questions......
1. Why don't people shower? I have been told many don't have showers but it seems that even those educated and wealthy ones that can afford to fly abroad also don't shower.
2. Why do people queue jump and then refuse to queue when asked? Is face so important that they cannot do the right thing? We were even scolded by the ticket seller for asking someone to queue because as she put it we were "causing trouble"!!!
3. Why does nobody smile here? is everyone's life so miserable?
4. Why do people like to argue with you and give you a million reasons why something is not possible? eg. The gas company workers, China Telecom, etc.
5. Why do people all give you a different answer (procedure) when you ask them how to do something? Ask 3 people in a company something and get 3 different procedures.
6. Why are people so selfish that they refuse to turn off their mobile phones in the cinema or during presentations, meetings. I even see couples in restaurants staring into their mobile phones SMSing instead focussing on each other.
7. Why do people have to shout into their mobile phones?
8. Why can't people let you get off a bus, elevator or subway before getting on?
9. Why do people just walk into you, even if you are the only person on the street at 11pm?
10. Why do people spit everywhere and throw garbage out of car windows and bus windows? Don't they love their country?
11. Why is China Eastern airlines flights always late or cancelled and nobody from the airline can tell you why?
12. Why do I, as a driver, have to pay 10% of a pedestrian's or cyclists "economic loss" if they do something stupid and hit me? This happened to me a few weeks ago. It is the law here. |
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Magnolia
Board Biatch
Joined: June 01, 2004
Posts: 31098
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July 16, 2004 - 03:07 PM |
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Sounds like you are having a "Bad China Day" today. It will pass.  |
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yu888
Board Deity
Joined: Jan 25, 2003
Posts: 18048
Location: ZhongShanParkArea SH
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July 17, 2004 - 09:07 AM |
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Actually, from a western perspective, all those questions make lots of sense and I really wish that someone could give me a concrete answer too. |
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knockknock_ca
PopStar
Joined: Nov 27, 2003
Posts: 1068
Status: Offline
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July 17, 2004 - 11:16 AM |
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| Post subject: Re: What is wrong with mainland Chinese? |
| good4kicks wrote: |
Some questions......
10. Why do people spit everywhere and throw garbage out of car windows and bus windows? Don't they love their country?
They were taught to be: in the train, there's a notice of "keep the train cabin clean, throw garbage outside of window" haha
11. Why is China Eastern airlines flights always late or cancelled and nobody from the airline can tell you why?
Not only China Eastern, but almost all of the local china airlines
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Andreas
Board Royalty
Joined: Feb 27, 2004
Posts: 6422
Location: 31 N 121 E
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July 17, 2004 - 02:16 PM |
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I think it is because a lot of people still display an unhealthy combination of ignorance, indifference, and ethnocentric arrogance. It is changing already a lot in the younger generation. But all in all there is still a long way to go. Well for a lot of us that's the reason why we are here, isn't it ? |
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If it has tits, tires, or a transom, there's gonna be issues! |
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livsnyter
Newbie
Joined: July 18, 2004
Posts: 6
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July 18, 2004 - 11:40 AM |
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Good4kicks, i've ONE question for you: Why don't you just stay home, when everything wich differ from your homecountry seems to annoying you that much? It's not about what's wrong with the chinese, they have always behaving like that (still remember you are in china?), it's more about: whats wrong with you.(?) If you still can't handle the differences, go back to your perfect home:) |
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Edgewood
FooSlinger
Joined: Jan 28, 2004
Posts: 3906
Location: Colonial Shanghai
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July 18, 2004 - 05:12 PM |
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livsnyter, ah yes, the usual reply. If you can't love Red China and sing its praises from the rooftops, better by far you get out and go home. We don't want you, we really don't want you to point out to us our weaknesses and flaws, because as most Chinese know, we Chinese are perfect. |
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Conlige suspectos semper habitos |
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livsnyter
Newbie
Joined: July 18, 2004
Posts: 6
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July 19, 2004 - 07:49 AM |
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edgewood,
Sorry I didn’t meant to sound like one who can’t take self-critic, none was my intention to say that Chinese are perfect. As a persons who was raised between two different cultures and during my travels around the world I just had enough of people who always try to understand other cultures from their own promises and find everything different “wrong”. If he had typed this topic as “why mainland Chinese behave like that?” instead of “what’t wrong with them?” I won’t have a word to say… |
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whocare
Talker
Joined: Mar 09, 2004
Posts: 76
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July 19, 2004 - 09:11 AM |
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| Post subject: Re: What is wrong with mainland Chinese? |
| good4kicks wrote: |
Some questions......
1. Why don't people shower? I have been told many don't have showers but it seems that even those educated and wealthy ones that can afford to fly abroad also don't shower. |
because most chinese are poor, the water is expensive.
i am afraid that landlord is worried when i take shower everyday in winter. but i understand that.
if you are good enough, you won't ask such a question.
the ppl below 30 are okay, and i think they take shower everyday in summer. but in winter, i do not know.
| good4kicks wrote: |
| 5. Why do people all give you a different answer (procedure) when you ask them how to do something? Ask 3 people in a company something and get 3 different procedures. |
this is why i am annoyed all the time... |
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shanghaibarry
Barker
Joined: May 18, 2004
Posts: 188
Location: Shanghai
Status: Offline
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July 19, 2004 - 12:24 PM |
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ask anyone on the street, the answer is:
Why are you asking these questions?
It's just the way it is here...
Western logic does not work in China, you got to put yourself in their shoes and pretend that you have gone through all their upbringings and exposed to all the media and propaganda to be able to understand the reasons for what seems to be unusual occurance in this land of middle kingdom.
Good luck, the bad feeling will go away and most people learn to accept that and realized what led to that gradually. |
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dbjiang
Seeker
Joined: July 16, 2004
Posts: 59
Status: Offline
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July 20, 2004 - 07:17 PM |
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| Post subject: Re: What is wrong with mainland Chinese? |
Some questions......
1. Why don't people shower? I have been told many don't have showers but it seems that even those educated and wealthy ones that can afford to fly abroad also don't shower.
A: Now I take shower everyday, multiple times a day. But in the past... When I was in university 20 years ago, 8 classmates crowded in a small room with 4 bunk beds. The public balneary opened 2 or 3 times a week. 15 years ago in Shanghai my flat still didn't have city-gas supply, I used a big boiler to boil water to fill tub, 2 or 3 boilers would have a decent bath. It's definitly I couldn't do it everyday. 10 years ago I had gas water-heater in my home, but in the winter the bathroom was damned cold, just as cold as outside. Now I live in a single house at Shanghai suburb, with 3 1/2 bathrooms and all air-conditioned. Of cause I will shower everyday. But, frankly, I don't wash my hair everyday. I hate going to bed with wet hair, otherwise I need a lot time to dry it. I normally wash hair in the morning, but I go to bed later and sometime I'd rather give the time for sleep instead of washing hair.
2. Why do people queue jump and then refuse to queue when asked? Is face so important that they cannot do the right thing? We were even scolded by the ticket seller for asking someone to queue because as she put it we were "causing trouble"!!!
A: hehe, you'd better insist your "ask". Many people will support you. But it's really a problem that many people loss their principle for face.
3. Why does nobody smile here? is everyone's life so miserable?
A: People listened too many stories like "Little red hat and wolf grandma", they tend to be alert with strangers, and keeping solemn face looks very cool  Seriously, some people don't think accosting others casually is polite. And chinese don't like to express heart openly. I know in small town people will greeting each other when they meet. But I don't think a guy in New York would stand on 42nd st. and giggle to everyone passing by. He will be thought having mental problem.
4. Why do people like to argue with you and give you a million reasons why something is not possible? eg. The gas company workers, China Telecom, etc.
A: The employee of state owned company always has this problem. No competitor, No pressure.
5. Why do people all give you a different answer (procedure) when you ask them how to do something? Ask 3 people in a company something and get 3 different procedures.
A: You should ask the professional training of this company.
6. Why are people so selfish that they refuse to turn off their mobile phones in the cinema or during presentations, meetings. I even see couples in restaurants staring into their mobile phones SMSing instead focussing on each other.
A: Chinese treat these activities like cinema, theatre, even concert more informal as casual entertainments. Yeah, thers's selfish inside, people normally care about the noise from others too. They just don't care the noise they made themselves. 
7. Why do people have to shout into their mobile phones?
A: The service quality of GSM is not good enough. People has difficulty to make his voice clear in another end. And, most people don't know the characteristic of digital encoding and modulation. They want to increase the volume of his voice to increase S/N ratio.
8. Why can't people let you get off a bus, elevator or subway before getting on?
A: Just like question 2.
9. Why do people just walk into you, even if you are the only person on the street at 11pm?
A: I didn't catch your meaning excactly. Sorry. If you mean why people don't keep enough space margin between each other, that is normal in China. There isn't so much space to keep in China. People have been in habit of it, and wouldn't make attention on that.
10. Why do people spit everywhere and throw garbage out of car windows and bus windows? Don't they love their country?
A: In some area, in some countryside, people do even spit in his own home! They lie on the bed with tobaco and spit just beside the beds! It's a question of civilization, living standard, and fairly a life habit. No excuse, but reality. BTW, I saw Beckham spit on the grass every 2 minutes in a soccer match. Did you ever see Yaoming spit in Toyota Center?
11. Why is China Eastern airlines flights always late or cancelled and nobody from the airline can tell you why?
A: Same as question 4.
12. Why do I, as a driver, have to pay 10% of a pedestrian's or cyclists "economic loss" if they do something stupid and hit me? This happened to me a few weeks ago. It is the law here.
A: You're lucky. From May 1st, by the new Traffic Safety Law, any accident involving a pedestrian or cyclist, the driver of the motor-vehicle has full liability to pay the compensation, even it's all the fault of pedestrian, you may be partly relieved but won't be completely exempted, unless you have evidence to prove the accident is deliberate. There're too many arguments in China upon this term. It's said this term follows the "No fault liability" terms in "Civil Law" aim to "dangerous activities". I won't say it's right or not. My choice is buy enough insurance.
It's just my opinions, I don't represent anyone else. |
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Andreas
Board Royalty
Joined: Feb 27, 2004
Posts: 6422
Location: 31 N 121 E
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July 20, 2004 - 09:20 PM |
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dbjiang,
A lot of your answers make perfect sense, I mean they give a plausible explanation. And some are humorous as well It does not mean of course that it justifies the problems.
I also think the behavior is changing, specially with the younger people. There are more and more people that realize that certain things are just not done.
Other things like item 12 for example are not any different in other countries. I remember when they changed the law in Holland, making any driver of a motor vehicle automatically liable in first instance, when bycicles or pedestrians are involved. Here it will hopefully lead to a more considerate and responsible driving style. Guess we will have to give it a bit more time  |
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If it has tits, tires, or a transom, there's gonna be issues! |
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dbjiang
Seeker
Joined: July 16, 2004
Posts: 59
Status: Offline
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July 20, 2004 - 11:04 PM |
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Thank you, Andreas.
I don't want to justify the problems. I just pretend I understand the existence of these problems. |
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judyzhou
Newbie
Joined: July 19, 2004
Posts: 6
Status: Offline
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July 21, 2004 - 12:23 AM |
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As a person who lived both in China and North America for some years, I can understand some of the questions. The only thing is: I can never agree that native Shanghai people don't shower everyday. Even about ten years ago when not every local family had an independent bath room, Shanghainese still tried to shower everyday or almost everyday.
By the way, I have to ask you: if Shangahi or Mainland China is so terrible, why you come here??? It seems you can hardly stay here in such a bad environment. Then go back enjoy your life in your own country! Good luck! |
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whocare
Talker
Joined: Mar 09, 2004
Posts: 76
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July 21, 2004 - 09:14 AM |
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| judyzhou wrote: |
As a person who lived both in China and North America for some years, I can understand some of the questions. The only thing is: I can never agree that native Shanghai people don't shower everyday. Even about ten years ago when not every local family had an independent bath room, Shanghainese still tried to shower everyday or almost everyday.
By the way, I have to ask you: if Shangahi or Mainland China is so terrible, why you come here??? It seems you can hardly stay here in such a bad environment. Then go back enjoy your life in your own country! Good luck! |
no, it is not the truth.
my landlord does not take shower everyday even in summer, in order to save money. do you understand? chinese ppl surely including shanghai ppl are not rich, some of them or most of them are quite poor, that is the truth. |
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judyzhou
Newbie
Joined: July 19, 2004
Posts: 6
Status: Offline
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July 22, 2004 - 12:03 AM |
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| Post subject: I doubt what kind of appt. do you live now? |
I don't know what kind of appt. do you rent and live now? If your landlord is so poor that he has to save the cost for shower even in summer, then I can understand what kind of person you deal with everyday!
Sorry to hear that you are living in such kind of room. Take care! |
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RaoulDuke
Talker
Joined: July 12, 2004
Posts: 102
Status: Offline
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July 22, 2004 - 04:22 AM |
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Questions that every expat asks here, eventually. It's such a wonderful country in so many ways...sometimes it just has this bloody-minded resistance to making any kind of sense that's absolutely infuriating. This is not a case of "Oh, that's just how we do things in China"...many of these things even Chinese people don't seem to like or understand, either.
Being required by law to pay a pedestrian for an accident that's entirely their fault? Please....show me some sense or justice in that. Please. If you can't do that, then at least tell me why it's a good thing. I double-dog dare you!
Screaming into phones is not just a GSM problem. A lot of face-to-face conversations here are held in voices that would etch glass, too. This is one reason I'll never take another ground-floor apartment. Actually, it's fun...next time your phone rings, pick it up and scream "Wei?" into it at the top of your lungs. Very therapeutic!
I have little trouble with queue jumping myself. I am extremely large and threatening-looking. (I wouldn't hurt a fly in reality, but why should I advertise that?) I have literally gently picked queue-jumpers up bodily and set them gently back down behind me. No problem. I will at the very least wedge them back out of my way....I absolutely do not let this kind of behavior stand. I couldn't possibly care less if you're the friend of the cousin of the uncle of the brother of the neighbor of the barber to the Junior Deputy Second Assistant Lieutenant Sub-Chief of Poultry Inspection for all of Jiangsu Province....shag your ass back to the end of the line.
I was a pretty meek person when I moved to China. Now I'm like that John Wayne toilet paper...I'm rough, and I'm tough, and I don't take crap off of anybody. |
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whocare
Talker
Joined: Mar 09, 2004
Posts: 76
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July 22, 2004 - 09:46 AM |
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| Post subject: Re: I doubt what kind of appt. do you live now? |
| judyzhou wrote: |
I don't know what kind of appt. do you rent and live now? If your landlord is so poor that he has to save the cost for shower even in summer, then I can understand what kind of person you deal with everyday!
Sorry to hear that you are living in such kind of room. Take care! |
That is the point, like you said, you deal with richer ppl, so you do not see the other side of the truth. The majority of Shanghai ppl are not rich, some of them are quite poor, dont you know the truth? The landlord is just one of the majority. I even know my landlord steals water using a special method to avoid to pay the money. |
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livsnyter
Newbie
Joined: July 18, 2004
Posts: 6
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July 22, 2004 - 10:41 AM |
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Another thing about the shower...
Have you ever noticed that many asians simply doesn't smell, even when they don’t shower for days? Have you ever seen a chinese using deodorant? They don’t even know what it is… |
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dbjiang
Seeker
Joined: July 16, 2004
Posts: 59
Status: Offline
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July 22, 2004 - 12:42 PM |
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Only few asian people use deodorant. These people have problem with body odor. Chinese call "body odor" as "Hu Chou", the odor of fox, that means it's not common in human beings. |
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shanghaibarry
Barker
Joined: May 18, 2004
Posts: 188
Location: Shanghai
Status: Offline
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July 22, 2004 - 01:42 PM |
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some explanations are good, and there are a lot of historical reasons to certain behaviors. But let me just add to the bumping into people on the street. I got bumped into in a few times while I was simply standing on the street waiting for my friends, strange that someone moving along the street can run into an idle standing person.
I reckon the reason is the lack of social-consciousness which has been the legacy of living environment and the lack of ownership of things in the past. If everything is run by the government, why should people care too much about using things properly? Just like spitting, since no one owns the street, it's not mine, and just litter and spit. who cares. Even at home, since their wives will clean the floor, it doesn't bother them to spit on the floor too. And since others can see that I am walking into that direction, they will avoid me, why should I care?
It takes generations to change that... |
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dbjiang
Seeker
Joined: July 16, 2004
Posts: 59
Status: Offline
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July 22, 2004 - 03:28 PM |
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| shanghaibarry wrote: |
| some explanations are good, and there are a lot of historical reasons to certain behaviors. ... |
SHbarry, you made an excellent comment. Trust me, some explanation of mine is just kidding. Many chinese hate these bad habits just like others. But please differentiate these thing separately. Somethings are apparently lack of social morality, and something is just a habit of his living style, and, something you can't ever say it's good or bad, it's just the way they live, like something in another post "why chinese like group shower"
And Raoulduke, regard question 12, I'm also confused inside about justice and reality. I guess you come form the states. I learnt there're two kinds of law systems. One of European contiment, another one from British-America. They have different principles to reach "justice". I'm not familiar with law. If anyone over there can clarify it, that will be greatly appreciated.
Regards, |
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Edgewood
FooSlinger
Joined: Jan 28, 2004
Posts: 3906
Location: Colonial Shanghai
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July 25, 2004 - 11:21 AM |
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livsnyter, I can honestly say you are correct: many asians don't smell, or rather don't smell bad, regardless of showering. Chinese however, are not amongst that lucky group. People here stink! I mean damn! There's some foul-smelling 'people' on the buses I am forced to take every day.
And while I'm at it: How does an entire nation manage to suffer from acute halitosis? |
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Conlige suspectos semper habitos |
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shanghaibarry
Barker
Joined: May 18, 2004
Posts: 188
Location: Shanghai
Status: Offline
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July 26, 2004 - 02:27 PM |
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Diet is to blame, garlic-heavy... but I guess some of the "aromatic" people you meet in public transportation may not be from Shanghai.
The same thing goes for Indians in India, I won't label that smelly, but it's just a concoction of smell from their diet with unique spices, oil they use for their hair etc.
What I call, "the scent of the orient" reaches its peak when you go into a small Xiali taxi in Beijing during winter with a driver that comes from the rural side of Beijing who sleep in the car for weeks. |
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Edgewood
FooSlinger
Joined: Jan 28, 2004
Posts: 3906
Location: Colonial Shanghai
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July 26, 2004 - 04:16 PM |
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shanghaibarry, no way! Indians when unwashed smell "aromatic" - Chinese when unwashed just stink. It can't be just diet - all the non-Chinese I know here eat the same things but smell just fine. And it's not a question of whether or not you are Shanghainese. I know Shanghainese **** doesn't smell because Shanghainese tell me so all the time. I just happen to disagree with that assessment.
'The scent of the orient' is not the same as the 'scent of China'. For once I'm not just picking a fight, it's really true! And it still doesn't explain the halitosis. |
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Conlige suspectos semper habitos |
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