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honestness in China

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jimNY

Squeeker

Joined: May 04, 2006
Posts: 12

Status: Offline

Posted: May 08, 2006 - 11:08 PM
Post subject: honestness in China

recent study Confucius's Analect, one of them says:
The philosopher Tsang said, "I daily examine myself on three
points:-whether, in transacting business for others, I may have been
not faithful;-whether, in intercourse with friends, I may have been
not sincere;-whether I may have not mastered and practiced the
instructions of my teacher."
As far as I know, this used to be the behavior rule for ancient intellectuals and it was extended to be rule for normal people in certain ancient time in China, however, it is pitty that it is not the case in China anymore. If you have chances to talk to Chinese people, you will see that everyone of them complains that Chinese people don't have honestness anymore. The whole society is so lack of credibility that in China very few credit cards are real credit cards, most of them are debit cards, 'cause the bank and credit card companies dare not issue real credit cards to average Chinese people with little credibility, for the same reason, Chinese banks don't issue personal checks, don't open phone bank for transferring money among accounts for average people and etc.

yu888
Board Deity

Joined: Jan 25, 2003
Posts: 17973
Location: ZhongShanParkArea SH

Posted: May 09, 2006 - 09:07 AM

I think you meant "Honesty" right? Seems you have had a very bad expereince here in China and I feel for you. But the generalisations you have illustrated and the anecdotal evidence don't jive with the experinece of the majority, only the small minority that tends to want to post about the negative expereinces. As for the credit versus debit situation, it is more due to the lack of credit ratings and cridit standards in the current banking system than and blanket lack of trust. The banking system is a mess and just cannot handle the paperwork needed to process personal checks and issue correct levels of credit to indivisuals in most cases, so they handle risk by not risking at all.

Your experience can be utterly different based on your race, gender, language ability and what groups in Shanghai/China you are accessing. Sounds to me based on your past posts you are still looking to eitehr learn Chinese (best case), or use it to meet more people(neutralk to worst case depenidng upon the type of people you want to meet) and given that it seems unlikely you have had a really good sampling to make such sweepiong generalizations with.

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Magnolia
Board Biatch

Joined: June 01, 2004
Posts: 31071

Posted: May 09, 2006 - 09:34 AM

jimNY wrote:

The whole society is so lack of credibility that in China very few credit cards are real credit cards, most of them are debit cards, 'cause the bank and credit card companies dare not issue real credit cards to average Chinese people with little credibility, for the same reason, Chinese banks don't issue personal checks, don't open phone bank for transferring money among accounts for average people and etc.

that has to be one of the stupidest arguments ever made.

yu has said it in a much more polite manner but what's up with your negativity? are you trying to stimulate online discussion or just fan flame wars? if you are this distrusting of the people in this country you aren't going to get anywhere by being negative and hateful. how many years did you live in ny?

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Rio
Post Boaster

Joined: Dec 04, 2004
Posts: 4724

Posted: May 09, 2006 - 09:50 AM

I don't want to be polite.

Shut up jimNY, you are making a fool out of yourself.

Go and educate yourself about China and Chinese people. Go read Michael H. Bond's "The Psychology of Chinese people".

kulthenius

Barker

Joined: Mar 04, 2006
Posts: 147
Location: sittin' on the Suzhou
Status: Offline

Posted: May 09, 2006 - 05:29 PM

Confucius might not've say this, but it sure does sound like something that would come from him:

man who stands on toilet is high on pot.

I enjoy reading Marcus Aurelius, Plato, Confucious, Mencius, Lao Zi, and Sun Zi. Philosophies great, but it has nothing to do with the majority of people and it never did, otherwise the world would be a much different place.

China's credit card system rocks bro. you get crucified in the U.S. with ungodly rates, here you can get a card no problem.

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man

FooJay

Joined: Mar 30, 2006
Posts: 1788

Status: Offline

Posted: May 10, 2006 - 11:53 PM

there was an article in a while saying basically, no company wants to introduce credit cards here as they dont trust any1. hes dead on the money. saving is 1 thing, paying debts another.

""I daily examine myself on three
points:-whether, in transacting business for others, I may have been
not faithful;-whether, in intercourse with friends, I may have been
not sincere;-whether I may have not mastered and practiced the
instructions of my teacher." "

no, no and yes, but then im a teacher so............

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tomnoddy_uk
Fire-eater

Joined: Mar 14, 2006
Posts: 2903

Posted: May 11, 2006 - 03:57 PM

re rio's book.

is Bond's book worth reading. is there a book on same topic by a chinese author someone could recommend so i can compare?

many thanks,

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tomnoddy_uk
Fire-eater

Joined: Mar 14, 2006
Posts: 2903

Posted: May 11, 2006 - 03:59 PM

and given the no. NPL's in china, i don't think issuing credit cards is not taking off for the reasons you state above, but rather the Chinese reluctance / fear of getting into debt. In fact, everyone is trying to stimulate chinese spending at the moment but its not working.

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Rio
Post Boaster

Joined: Dec 04, 2004
Posts: 4724

Posted: May 11, 2006 - 04:27 PM

Hi Tom,

Michael H. Bond is a professor at the Chinese University in Hong Kong. Obviously a Western guy as his name can tell but an expert in Chinese culture/psychology as he has the China experience. His literature was very very useful for my master thesis. I do not think you can buy this book in China though, I bought it in HK last June. You do not need a Chinese author writing about a similar topic. Bond will describe the psychology of Chinese people from both Chinese and Western perspective. An excellent way to learn more about Chinese people.

lazyyorkie

LoopKicker

Joined: Apr 20, 2006
Posts: 990

Status: Offline

Posted: May 11, 2006 - 11:29 PM
Post subject: Chinese people don't have honestness anymore.

Interesting and sweeping statement.

The credit card companies see China as a golden opportunity.

Some Chinese are dishonest but, surely there are good and bad in all countries. With 1.3 billion people the numbers will be higher in China.

Compaired to Detroit,NY and LA then Chinese are way down the list of being dishonest and bad people.

Most Chinese save like hell because, of poor welfare and the need to provide good education to their sibblings. These savings actually take a lot of money out of circulation, the government want to improve welfare in order to release some of the savings back into the economy. Not easy when you have to provide health care for 1/3 of the worlds population or there abouts.

acujerjer
Board Royalty

Joined: Sep 10, 2003
Posts: 7770
Location: up your butt and around the corner

Posted: May 12, 2006 - 05:56 PM

Jim, you know what brother, dishonesty is everywhere! You from NY? Come on. The amount of sleaze and corruption in America is outrageous. Until you learn that everyone everywhere is equally as fuuked up, you have not learned the golden rule of traveling.