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Black out in Sydney, and black out in Shanghai?

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theAutumn45
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Joined: Oct 28, 2005
Posts: 796

Posted: Apr 01, 2007 - 05:29 AM
Post subject: Black out in Sydney, and black out in Shanghai?

Let’s wish Shanghai would do the same!

Sydney in climate change blackout

Lights have been turned off across Australia's largest city, Sydney, in a hour-long event aimed at raising awareness of global warming.
At 1930 (0930 GMT) the city's skyline dimmed and normally bright landmarks like the Opera House and the Harbour Bridge went dark.
The so-called Earth Hour is supported by the New South Wales government, environmental groups and businesses.
Sydney hopes the event will make a very big statement on climate change.
The city of four million people is aiming to become the first anywhere to achieve a blackout on this scale.
The BBC's Phil Mercer, in Sydney, says by and large Sydney had never been this dark.
He says lights were off in the majority of the central business district's office blocks and large parts of the suburbs were also in darkness.

Co-operation

Greg Bourne of environmental group WWF, one of the driving forces behind Earth Hour, said the big switch off took months to plan.
"The logistics is really quite amazing in the sense every tower block is owned by one company, maybe leased by another company, have 10 tenants in and a manager and working through all of these people has been fantastic."
Many restaurants signed up and planned to serve diners by candlelight.
The owner of the Newtown Hotel, which says it is Australia's oldest gay bar, told the BBC before the blackout that they would have fun while trying to send a serious message.
"Sometimes drag queens [female impersonators] do look better in the dark anyway," said Roger Zee.
"It's up to the patrons. They'll actually have their own torches so they'll be able to light up the drag queens on the stage themselves."
Organisers want to encourage Australians to conserve energy and to think carefully about what they can do to cut pollution.
Every day millions of lights and computers are left on in deserted office blocks as well as in apartments and houses.

Campaigners have said that simply switching them off could reduce Sydney's greenhouse gas emissions by 5% over the next year.
Australia is one of the world's largest per capita producers of carbon dioxide and other gases that many scientists believe are helping to warm the earth's atmosphere.

Last edited by theAutumn45 on Apr 01, 2007 - 11:21 AM; edited 1 time in total

Generic_User_Name

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Joined: Mar 14, 2007
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Posted: Apr 01, 2007 - 10:47 AM

Good idea, but too late. Sydney (see correct spelling Autumn) will have a major water problem in five years according to certain sources.

And of course, Shanghai will never do such a thing unless it was to save electricity - not to make people aware of global warming. China is now a member of the Kyoto Protocol but only after being strong-armed into it after becoming a member of the WTO. Foe example, a couple of years ago in Shanghai during a particularly hot and dry spell the local government sent aircraft into the sky to spray CO2 into the atmosphere to make it rain. This was to make everyone turn off their air-cons. Hardly, environmentally friendly, but effective nonetheless.

All this talk these days about saving the environment is just lip-service. Serios action should have been taken thirty years ago.

In the words of Mr Bowie - 'Five years, that's all we got....'

bougie
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Joined: Nov 20, 2004
Posts: 13323
Location: Wuhan Hubei China

Posted: Apr 01, 2007 - 11:24 AM

We are doomed ...

Generic_User_Name

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Joined: Mar 14, 2007
Posts: 713

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Posted: Apr 01, 2007 - 11:48 AM

Shut up and skin up.

bougie
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Joined: Nov 20, 2004
Posts: 13323
Location: Wuhan Hubei China

Posted: Apr 01, 2007 - 12:48 PM

Ok here ... Embarassed

sienna
Low Seater

Joined: July 17, 2006
Posts: 3440
Location: kiss my ass

Posted: Apr 02, 2007 - 12:02 AM

Lazyheads, do something instead of complaining. I have started to turn off the computer/TV when Im not using it. I use low energy light bulbs, I have started to recycle, I walk instead of letting my parents drive me, etc

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tomnoddy_uk
Fire-eater

Joined: Mar 14, 2006
Posts: 2907

Posted: Apr 02, 2007 - 10:25 AM

Yeh, use a bike, not taxis or public busses!!

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bougie
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Joined: Nov 20, 2004
Posts: 13323
Location: Wuhan Hubei China

Posted: Apr 03, 2007 - 09:14 PM

I grow my own smoke intsead of buying it. And I keep my roaches for recyclng. Sometimes I consider using condoms twice

CoffeeHawk_0
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Joined: July 14, 2005
Posts: 14444

Posted: Apr 03, 2007 - 10:41 PM

...there's still a lot of scientists that say this is all nothing more than a normal warming trend....a 30 year spike of temperature 'rise', which happens to follow a 30 period of temperature decline.

do the Al Gore videos mention that the world's single biggest source of C02 is mammels and decaying plant matter?

there's absolutley nothing wrong with being environmentally friendly, I support it. Keep one eye on the planet, and keep your other eye on the people that will use this 'threat' as a means to take your money.

sienna
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Joined: July 17, 2006
Posts: 3440
Location: kiss my ass

Posted: Apr 04, 2007 - 01:41 AM

Aiya, don't say that!!! I mean, yes, there might be a tiny chance that it's not because of global warming. but come on, it's 99% likely it is.
it's really big here in sweden, they have articles in the newspaper everyday about global warming. hmm, those scientists you are mentioning, is there a chance that they are from the US?? hmm, in order to defend the country of how much they discharge of CO2?

Did u know, now it has becomen more dagerous to eat fish because of the global warming, and the seals are dying as the ice is breaking!!

Don't deny the fact!!!!!!!!!

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CoffeeHawk_0
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Joined: July 14, 2005
Posts: 14444

Posted: Apr 04, 2007 - 07:07 AM

It's easy enough to show a trend in temperatures, but 'knowing' what is causing the temperature change is the issue. The graph below shows the suns output vs land temperature. Can anyone find a piece of data to show that spending $2000 more (to make emmissions cleaner) on your next car can counter-effect the sun, let alone volcanoes, etc.?

from http://xtronics.com/reference/globalwarming.htm

First, you have to prove that the increase in CO2 is caused by humans - the venting of CO2 by volcanoes (including those under the ocean) and geysers and other natural sources (and also the natural absorption or sinking of CO2) is a estimate that defies error analysis. To what error band are we certain of the amount of emission of CO2 by natural causes?

Second, the elevation of CO2 needs to be shown to be historically real, but there were no analytical tools to measure even crudely thousands of years ago - the best work has been done with ice samples, but there is a great problem with how to calibrate such measurements. What size should the error bands be? I believe that man is likely responsible for a small increase in CO2 - this a my belief, supported by a lot of data.

Third, there has to be a hypothesis that can predict the past (only then can we start guessing about the future) including the temperatures in the upper atmosphere. Any model that can't fit past data has to be called wrong.

Fourth, as this is an open system where we can't build several earths and vary only one constant, any conclusion at best is still just a theory - a educated guess - it is not scientific fact. Science is more than looking scientific; just because things are measured to several decimal points means naught when there is no control or false logic.

Fifth, to look at the past temperatures honestly, one would have to show no past periods of higher temperature. The idea that we 'know the inferred data' - is simply wrong. We don't have accurate records of solar output from the past and we don't know the magnitude of long term historic variations that are possible. Explaining the small drift (less than what appears to be the noise in the system) is much better accomplished with a solar output theory - yet even this theory fails to be more than a theory for those who seeking the truth.

See http://web.dmi.dk/solar-terrestrial/space_weather/

Six, one really has to subtract the effects of variations of solar output, and changes in land use (irrigation) from any temperature trends. There is no way to do this with any meaningful accuracy.

CoffeeHawk_0
Board Buddha

Joined: July 14, 2005
Posts: 14444

Posted: Apr 04, 2007 - 07:13 AM

and, this page helps clarify things by showing the DECREASE in atmospheric temperature whereas the graph above shows the increase in LAND temperature. http://www.ghcc.msfc.nasa.gov/MSU/msusci.html

The earth and the atmosphere are 2 large themal capacitors and each have a different thermal capacitance (heat holding capacity) and a different heating and cooling rates. It's like a McDonald's apple pie, the crust cools off much quicker than the filling; you can't accurately measure the temperature change of the pie by just considering the crust or the filling.

skyline5k

Shanghai Royalty

Joined: Sep 06, 2004
Posts: 8685
Location: i am ERROR
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Posted: Apr 04, 2007 - 10:10 AM

sienna wrote:

it's 99% likely it is.

75% of statistics are made up on the spot.

But I've heard that as well. Global Warming is nature, as is Global Cooling. These trends have happened before, and will happen again. We could certainly do with some environmentalism, true enough, but the world's been around for about 4.5 billion years. It's seen its changes, and will continue to change.

One of these days, Australia will wake up with a hangover & find itself in the Atlantic Ocean!

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