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MyNameIsPablo
StreetBeater
Joined: Sep 06, 2007
Posts: 2455
Status: Offline
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 Posted:
Oct 18, 2007 - 10:53 AM |
 
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| Post subject: George Bush meets the da1a¡ 1ama. |
t¡bet leader awarded top US medal
The da1a¡ 1ama, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, Sen Robert Byrd and US President George W Bush
Beijing is furious at the US award for the da1a¡ 1ama
da1a¡ 1ama's speech
The da1a¡ 1ama has been awarded a Congressional Gold Medal - the top US civilian honour - in a move that has infuriated China.
George W Bush attended the ceremony in Washington, the first time a sitting US president has appeared in public with the exiled t¡betan leader.
Chinese state media had warned it would "cast a shadow" over ties with the US.
Beijing has been accused of human rights abuses in t¡bet, which its communist troops occupied in 1951.
'Man of peace'
Mr Bush led the 72-year-old Buddhist leader into the Capitol Rotunda, holding his hand as they entered before sitting side-by-side.
CONGRESSIONAL GOLD MEDAL
Top US civilian award
Originally awarded to soldiers for achievement in battle, but became civilian award with introduction of Medal of Honor
First awarded in 1776 to General George Washington
Two-third majority required to approve each candidate
Each medal uniquely designed and created by the US Mint
Over 100 medals awarded
Previous winners include Mother Teresa, Nelson Mandela Tony Blair, Winston Churchill and Pope John Paul II
As he presented the medal, Mr Bush hailed the Nobel Peace Prize winner as a "universal symbol of peace and tolerance".
"I will continue to urge the leaders of China to welcome the da1a¡ 1ama to China," Mr Bush said.
"They will find this good man to be a man of peace and reconciliation."
He said the US could not close its eyes to the plight of the religiously oppressed.
The t¡betan leader said he was "deeply touched" to receive such a "great honour".
"I believe that this award also sends a powerful message to those individuals who are dedicated to promoting peace," the da1a¡ 1ama said.
'Gross interference'
Mr Bush met the da1a¡ 1ama behind closed doors on Tuesday in the White House residence, rather than the Oval Office, out of deference to China. It was their third private meeting in six years.
But Wednesday's elaborate ceremony was a much more public affair.
Beijing described it as a "gross interference in China's internal affairs".
"China is strongly resentful of this and resolutely opposes it," foreign ministry spokesman Liu Jianchao was quoted by the official Xinhua news agency as saying.
An editorial in the official China Daily newspaper said: "This event will certainly cast a shadow over the relations."
Beijing has long argued the da1a¡ 1ama is seeking to destroy China's sovereignty by pushing for independence for devoutly Buddhist t¡bet.
He insists he wants "real autonomy", not independence for the region, which Beijing claims is an "inalienable" part of China.
Balancing act
Analysts say it is a delicate diplomatic balancing act for Mr Bush, who needs China's help to manage nuclear standoffs with Iran and North Korea.
US President George W Bush and the da1a¡ 1ama
It was the first time a US president had appeared with the da1a¡ 1ama in public
Meanwhile, China's Communist Party, which is holding its 17th Congress this week, is highly sensitive to potential embarrassment as it prepares to stage next year's Olympics.
US lawmakers regularly accuse Beijing of turning a blind eye to alleged human rights abuses in Burma and Sudan in its pursuit of energy and business deals.
Recently, world leaders have grown more vocal in their concern for human rights in t¡bet.
In September, German Chancellor Angela Merkel met the da1a¡ 1ama, incurring Beijing's wrath.
The da1a¡ 1ama has also met Austrian Chancellor Alfred Gusenbauer and Australian Prime Minister John Howard this year, and is due to meet Canadian Prime Minister Stephen Harper later this month.
China was outraged when Canada granted the da1a¡ 1ama honorary citizenship last year.
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'They will find this good man to be a man of peace and reconciliation.'
Hahahahahaha!!!!
I don't know what I find funnier - the fact that China is so pissed off that America has done this or Bush pretending to be an advocate of peace in the world.
America and China - what a gig they got.... |
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Quiet - Or Papa Spank. |
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ShanghaiUnderground
StreetBeater
Joined: July 15, 2004
Posts: 2413
Location: Shanghai
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Oct 18, 2007 - 11:09 AM |
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Yep, bad news. Lead levels in toys will only increase now. |
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"And this also," said Marlow suddenly, "has been one of the dark places of the earth." |
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hc
Post Roaster
Joined: Apr 04, 2007
Posts: 4545
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Oct 18, 2007 - 11:27 AM |
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Doing it while Beijing is having its CPC meeting is completely, thoroughly idiotic and sends a very wrong signal me thinks.
Very bad move, very bad timing.
Another great fk up. Congratulations.
What is most surprising though is how world's great leaders are ignorant of the history of the relations between China and the da1a¡ 1ama and how the later was sole responsible for the mess we are in right now due to his complete lack of foresight when Beijing was in conciliatory mode.
Ironically it was Mao who wanted to have t¡bet on its own terms, without interfering in the region that the US and the UK recognized as a province of China. |
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MyNameIsPablo
StreetBeater
Joined: Sep 06, 2007
Posts: 2455
Status: Offline
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Oct 18, 2007 - 11:50 AM |
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Can you imagine the conversation between Bush and the da1a¡ 1ama?
'Hey nice orange robe! Where can I get one?' |
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Quiet - Or Papa Spank. |
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ShanghaiUnderground
StreetBeater
Joined: July 15, 2004
Posts: 2413
Location: Shanghai
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Oct 18, 2007 - 12:49 PM |
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And da1a¡ replies, "The same place your military gets its uniforms: China." |
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"And this also," said Marlow suddenly, "has been one of the dark places of the earth." |
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Kiwi
Post Boaster
Joined: May 07, 2003
Posts: 4763
Status: Offline
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Oct 18, 2007 - 01:01 PM |
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Mao didn't want to interfere in t¡bet?
Oh no. . . the poor guy. So misunderstood. |
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hc
Post Roaster
Joined: Apr 04, 2007
Posts: 4545
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Oct 18, 2007 - 01:14 PM |
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^ He did not want to interfere in the region, that's exactly right. He wanted to grant them as much autonomy as necessary in the early 50s. He of course wanted to keep its status as a province but on terms that were reasonable to t¡bet at the time.
Things went downhill from there (as external interference and the desire to have a sore in the early Communist China was convenient to the US).
Of course not something that the media is happy to pass along, although if you read up on the subject you will notice how easy it would have been to have solved the situation decades ago. |
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hc
Post Roaster
Joined: Apr 04, 2007
Posts: 4545
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Oct 18, 2007 - 01:16 PM |
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kevinhenan
Talker
Joined: Feb 01, 2007
Posts: 107
Location: changning district, shanghai
Status: Offline
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Oct 18, 2007 - 02:57 PM |
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t¡bet and taiwan, a huge(because both are part of and important for china) and little(because their status is clear and of no doubt) issue for china.
critics from abroad only makes pra more vigilant, cpc more united, china more powerful.
that is it. |
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kevin:all the world is a very narrow bridge and the important thing is not to be afraid to fall off! |
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kevinhenan
Talker
Joined: Feb 01, 2007
Posts: 107
Location: changning district, shanghai
Status: Offline
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Oct 18, 2007 - 02:59 PM |
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it should be pla the people's liberation army |
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kevin:all the world is a very narrow bridge and the important thing is not to be afraid to fall off! |
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ThomasCaron
Raver
Joined: Dec 11, 2006
Posts: 472
Location: Shanghai
Status: Offline
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Oct 18, 2007 - 04:22 PM |
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No flies on Tenzin Gyatso. He sees them come and he sees them go. |
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sbergman
Veejay
Joined: Sep 12, 2007
Posts: 2167
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Oct 18, 2007 - 04:50 PM |
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I believe there are approximately 1.65 million ethnic t¡betans worldwide, about the population of Dublin. I can't help but wonder how much China has elevated the importance of the da1a¡ 1ama by making him a "leader in exile." |
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Kiwi
Post Boaster
Joined: May 07, 2003
Posts: 4763
Status: Offline
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Oct 18, 2007 - 06:25 PM |
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HC I'll have to read up more on t¡bet. To be honest I don't know a whole lot about it.
Not that I'm rabidly anti China on the thing. . . In a weird way they may have done some good by going in there.
As for the 'Mao didn't want to interfere' stuff though. . . The CCP spouted that line everywhere. . . They were enthusiastically supported autonomy for the non-Han regions of the 'country' (which was really a 'defunct Qing empire') until they found themselves in a strong position. Their promises then turned out to be empty. A total change in attitude, and the passage of time has only seen them become more paranoid on these issues.
The non-han regions were probably better off under the old Qing Empire. At least then they only had to deal with old fashioned imperialism, with none of this rewritten history, forced Han immigration, 'one happy nation' crap. |
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lalaabc321
Veejay
Joined: Dec 07, 2004
Posts: 2002
Status: Offline
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Oct 18, 2007 - 07:04 PM |
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kiwi
so you support those nations made up of single race
I have to say...
you must come from German rather than that country which had a great history of forced anglo-sexxon immigration
Guten tag! |
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sinkin my fingertips into every inch of you |
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babebibobu
LoopKicker
Joined: Sep 29, 2007
Posts: 946
Status: Offline
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Oct 18, 2007 - 07:14 PM |
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This is the same regime that sponsored Osama Bin Laden. I am not surprised they also support the so called da1a¡ 1ama. A living god receiving a medal from the president of the US. Thats funny. |
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I'm dancing with tears in my eyes... 'cause the girl in my arms is a boy |
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hc
Post Roaster
Joined: Apr 04, 2007
Posts: 4545
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Oct 18, 2007 - 07:35 PM |
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CoffeeHawk_0
Board Buddha
Joined: July 14, 2005
Posts: 14444
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Oct 18, 2007 - 08:00 PM |
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in the example they give in the article, a 14 year old kills 3 people and was intent on killing a 4th, and showed no remorse or conscious in court. This was a jury trial BTW. The murdered were shot, stabbed, and then set on fire.
What would you (anyone here) need to know to be comfortable living next door to this person when they're 20? 30? 60? You and your family will get no gaurentee of safety, just a new neighbor with a felony record. |
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Kiwi
Post Boaster
Joined: May 07, 2003
Posts: 4763
Status: Offline
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Oct 18, 2007 - 08:16 PM |
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The son of a family friend was killed by a 12 year old while he was delivering a pizza. The delightful little scoundrel now sees himself as some kind of celebrity. Word is he has put together a little scrapbook of press clippings on the case. His teacher must be pleased he's finally taking an interest in current affairs. He'll be out of prison by the time he's 20 and no doubt go on to kill many more people. |
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lalaabc321
Veejay
Joined: Dec 07, 2004
Posts: 2002
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Oct 18, 2007 - 08:33 PM |
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well, highly secured insititution could cure or contain those people
rather than prison |
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hc
Post Roaster
Joined: Apr 04, 2007
Posts: 4545
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Oct 18, 2007 - 08:44 PM |
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"He'll be out of prison by the time he's 20 and no doubt go on to kill many more people."
No doubt? How so? What makes you think so?
Then can we assume that the institutions taking care of the boy today are ineffective?
Or that his education is lacking perhaps?
What motived him to do what he did in your opinion Kiwi?
Inst preventing these things from happening equally or perhaps MORE important?
I hardly think laws would be a deterrent for a 12 year old. |
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Kiwi
Post Boaster
Joined: May 07, 2003
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Oct 18, 2007 - 08:59 PM |
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Just checked info on his latest parole hearing and it seems he gets out of prison September 2008. So he'll be out by 18 years old.
Would laws be a deterrent for a 12 year old? I think even a 12 year old knows that you don't bash people to death - after having first lured them to an address with the intention of robbing them.
The institutions are ineffective? Surely the blame lies with the scallywag himself? I know it's fashionable to blame some institution, but. . .
I've no idea what motivated him to do it. But just possibly he's simply a violent deranged little ****?
I doubt it's possible to rehabilitate trash like this so locking them up permanently may not such a bad idea. . . Or at least lock them up until they are old and feeble enough to no longer pose a serious threat? Giving society the right to just lock people up indefinitely seems wrong, but when you are dealing with people highly likely to re-offend perhaps its for the greater good? The latest report from the parole board considered him highly likely to re-offend if released early, which makes you wonder if it makes sense to release him at all.
Difficult questions anyway. |
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hc
Post Roaster
Joined: Apr 04, 2007
Posts: 4545
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Oct 18, 2007 - 09:32 PM |
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I have to say I dont have an answer and I am undecided as to what to do with this boy. I really dont know. I tend to think that studying the causes might help to design something that deals to the effect better. In my country, where criminality is not low, inequality plays a major role i.e. presumably the problem is more economical than anything, hence my bias towards assuming the individual can always be saved.
But I find it odd that 185 countries would go one way and one country would go the other way, ironically a country with high percentage of gun ownership, a culture of extreme violence as their leadership clearly demonstrates, death sentences, and so forth.
Ironically all these attributes the opposite of what the da1a¡ 1ama is supposed to represent as portrayed by the media. |
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CoffeeHawk_0
Board Buddha
Joined: July 14, 2005
Posts: 14444
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Oct 19, 2007 - 06:54 AM |
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So no one wants to answer about having a mass murderer living next store to them.
How about a 15 yeard old pedophile? How many years in jail before you'd be happy to have them live next store to you and your family?
185:1 means nothing as a stand alone argument. What's the alternative? |
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wolfy
Fire-eater
Joined: Sep 13, 2004
Posts: 2510
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Oct 19, 2007 - 09:13 AM |
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| Kiwi wrote: |
| The institutions are ineffective? Surely the blame lies with the scallywag himself? I know it's fashionable to blame some institution, but. . . |
I blame computer games. |
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lalaabc321
Veejay
Joined: Dec 07, 2004
Posts: 2002
Status: Offline
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Oct 19, 2007 - 09:27 AM |
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so da1a¡ 1ama played PC games and also Nintendo well when he was 15?
that's topic of this thread? |
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