| Author |
Message |
teezy123
Seeker
Joined: Mar 21, 2008
Posts: 70
Status: Offline
|
 Posted:
Aug 13, 2008 - 03:39 PM |
 
|
| Post subject: Currency Exchange Restrictions for RO vs Personal |
1) Does an RO have currency exchange (foreign to RMB) limitations similar to those of a private individual? For example, if a private persons exchange is being transacted it will be checked against his ID through SAFE to see if the person has exceeded the yearly USD50k quota.
Is there a similar system in place for an RO? What are the procedures?
2) I have been told by Bank of China staff that ATM withdrawals using a foreign card do not count against the $50k balance. Is this true?
Thank you.
(How do I move this post to a different forum?) |
|
|
|
|
yu888
Board Deity
Joined: Jan 25, 2003
Posts: 18042
Location: ZhongShanParkArea SH
|
| Posted:
Aug 13, 2008 - 05:43 PM |
|
|
|
 
 |
|
pat_togo
Raver
Joined: Feb 22, 2005
Posts: 403
Location: Pudong & Hongkou, Shanghai
Status: Offline
|
| Posted:
Aug 13, 2008 - 05:58 PM |
|
|
|
 |
|
teezy123
Seeker
Joined: Mar 21, 2008
Posts: 70
Status: Offline
|
| Posted:
Aug 13, 2008 - 06:25 PM |
|
|
@yu - Yes, RO = Representative Office.
@pat - My question was mainly about funds going into the RO. Are you saying is that all incoming USD to RMB conversions by an RO do not get checked against a file at the SAFE.
additional question... can the RO use those funds to make payments on behalf of the host company. I have heard conflicting information about the legality and taxation of ROs. It is my understanding that RO is technically not allowed to enagage in profit operations, but that in practice it is accepted since the government collects taxes based on the RO expenses. Also, I have heard that some expenses (particularly related to export) are tax exempt when the RO files income tax.
thank you again. i will be at malones tonite for dinner and mixer. maybe some experienced people can shed some light. |
|
|
|
|
|
underh20
Shanghai Royalty
Joined: Sep 27, 2006
Posts: 9905
Location: EOA Seminar
|
| Posted:
Aug 13, 2008 - 07:18 PM |
|
|
| pat_togo wrote: |
| 2) Yes it doesn't count since they have no way to match your foreign account with your individual file at the safe. |
Wrong reason, right result.
The only reason it doesn't count is because they are earning a commission on the actual transfer and the resulting currency exchange.
Even though your ATM receipt only shows your card number, your name is available to the banking entity. They could match that with SAFE if they wanted to. The fact that they don't is because a) they are earning $$ off of you, and b) it would be a hassle for them to do it while inconveniencing potential tourists. Besides, there is a daily limit and you'd have to hit the ATM up every day for nearly half a year to even reach the $50k limit. |
|
|
|
|
|
teezy123
Seeker
Joined: Mar 21, 2008
Posts: 70
Status: Offline
|
| Posted:
Aug 13, 2008 - 07:34 PM |
|
|
| underh20 wrote: |
| pat_togo wrote: |
| 2) Yes it doesn't count since they have no way to match your foreign account with your individual file at the safe. |
Wrong reason, right result.
The only reason it doesn't count is because they are earning a commission on the actual transfer and the resulting currency exchange.
Even though your ATM receipt only shows your card number, your name is available to the banking entity. They could match that with SAFE if they wanted to. The fact that they don't is because a) they are earning $$ off of you, and b) it would be a hassle for them to do it while inconveniencing potential tourists. Besides, there is a daily limit and you'd have to hit the ATM up every day for nearly half a year to even reach the $50k limit. |
Are they not also earning money off the spread when I do a regular counter exchange. So, that reason also seems to be wrong. It's unlikely that a tourist would ever reach this limit.
Do you have any idea about the other part of my question regarding RO taxation and limitations on USD to RMB exchange? |
|
|
|
|
|
teezy123
Seeker
Joined: Mar 21, 2008
Posts: 70
Status: Offline
|
| Posted:
Aug 13, 2008 - 07:38 PM |
|
|
Oh yea, I have several cards that are for commercial accounts in the US. I dont see SAFE could check those against my passport number. So they do not necessarily have the ability to track ATM withdrawals. |
|
|
|
|
|
underh20
Shanghai Royalty
Joined: Sep 27, 2006
Posts: 9905
Location: EOA Seminar
|
| Posted:
Aug 13, 2008 - 09:10 PM |
|
|
| teezy123 wrote: |
| underh20 wrote: |
| pat_togo wrote: |
| 2) Yes it doesn't count since they have no way to match your foreign account with your individual file at the safe. |
Wrong reason, right result.
The only reason it doesn't count is because they are earning a commission on the actual transfer and the resulting currency exchange.
Even though your ATM receipt only shows your card number, your name is available to the banking entity. They could match that with SAFE if they wanted to. The fact that they don't is because a) they are earning $$ off of you, and b) it would be a hassle for them to do it while inconveniencing potential tourists. Besides, there is a daily limit and you'd have to hit the ATM up every day for nearly half a year to even reach the $50k limit. |
Are they not also earning money off the spread when I do a regular counter exchange. So, that reason also seems to be wrong. It's unlikely that a tourist would ever reach this limit. |
Your understanding of basic international financial transactions is severely lacking.
When you obtain foreign exchange via an ATM, they are earning the forex conversion spread as well as the network interchange fee. Soon you will start seeing a new fee also -- ATM operator fees. |
|
|
|
|
|
underh20
Shanghai Royalty
Joined: Sep 27, 2006
Posts: 9905
Location: EOA Seminar
|
| Posted:
Aug 13, 2008 - 09:14 PM |
|
|
| teezy123 wrote: |
| Oh yea, I have several cards that are for commercial accounts in the US. I dont see SAFE could check those against my passport number. So they do not necessarily have the ability to track ATM withdrawals. |
They do not need passport numbers. They have easy access to the account holder's name in exactly the same way as the US government has access to information regarding any US$ cross-border transactions.
Business credit cards have the authorized user's data transmitted with each transaction unless your credit card simply has a business name embossed on it -- which is highly unlikely. That you don't realize that makes your claims to have business credit cards suspect. |
|
|
|
|
|
teezy123
Seeker
Joined: Mar 21, 2008
Posts: 70
Status: Offline
|
| Posted:
Aug 14, 2008 - 12:12 PM |
|
|
First of all, your understanding things seems to be limited and you also like to imagine people have said things that they did not say.
The point is that the banks are making money off both transactions, so that doesn't make sense as the incentive to not enforce the $50k limit. In some cases, there is no transaction fee either. For example, I do most ATM withdrawals through CCB with BoA cards.
Secondly, you would have to be rather dull to truly believe that there is enough uniqueness in names to think that people can be identified just by that means. I also never said anything about names not being on business cards, simply said that they are not linked to any number they could use to identify me within a system like the one SAFE uses. |
|
|
|
|
|
underh20
Shanghai Royalty
Joined: Sep 27, 2006
Posts: 9905
Location: EOA Seminar
|
| Posted:
Aug 14, 2008 - 01:22 PM |
|
|
| teezy123 wrote: |
| The point is that the banks are making money off both transactions, so that doesn't make sense as the incentive to not enforce the $50k limit. In some cases, there is no transaction fee either. For example, I do most ATM withdrawals through CCB with BoA cards. |
They make more when you get your cash at an ATM. Gee, now isn't that a novel idea? 
As for the CCB - BoA alliance, BoA paid a several million $ to the Chinese government to buy a stake in CCB so maybe they don't care about not getting any ATM fees ... for now.
| teezy123 wrote: |
| Secondly, you would have to be rather dull to truly believe that there is enough uniqueness in names to think that people can be identified just by that means. I also never said anything about names not being on business cards, simply said that they are not linked to any number they could use to identify me within a system like the one SAFE uses. |
The PBOC & CBRC -- to include SAFE, obviously -- uses only three identifiers: name, ID type and ID#. For expats the ID type must be "passport" unless you have permanent residency -- which you don't.
I have actually seen how the PBOC system works and if you enter ID type and last name they do get hits. Believe it or not, they are smart enough to realize that Smith, J. D. and Smith, James D. are a likely match and flag it for further questioning.
Most people when they don't know WTF they are talking about stand silent. Isn't it the same on your planet? |
|
|
|
|
|
teezy123
Seeker
Joined: Mar 21, 2008
Posts: 70
Status: Offline
|
| Posted:
Aug 14, 2008 - 02:04 PM |
|
|
@under
In order to make this post nice and easy for you to understand, I will enumerate my points.
1) You are speculating on the reasons and very obviously dont know WTF you are talking about. A little information can be a dangerous thing, especially for someone like you.
2) You make non-sequential arguments in the vast majority of your posts throughout this site.
3) The purpose of a forum is to share information. When there is something about which you no little or even if you "don't know what the **** you are talking about", then you can post a question (as opposed to remaining silent). That is a novel idea isnt it?
4) Here on planet Earth, asking and answering questions is a commonly used method of sharing information. But unfortunately, productive communication is occasionally interrupted by insecure people that we call ***h0les. I am sure you are familiar with people like that on your planet.
Do you ever go to the Malone's Wednesday mixer or other SHExpat events? It would be nice to put a face to such a special online personality as yourself. Have a nice day. |
|
|
|
|
|
underh20
Shanghai Royalty
Joined: Sep 27, 2006
Posts: 9905
Location: EOA Seminar
|
| Posted:
Aug 14, 2008 - 06:56 PM |
|
|
| teezy123 wrote: |
@under
In order to make this post nice and easy for you to understand, I will enumerate my points.
1) You are speculating on the reasons and very obviously dont know WTF you are talking about. A little information can be a dangerous thing, especially for someone like you.
2) You make non-sequential arguments in the vast majority of your posts throughout this site.
3) The purpose of a forum is to share information. When there is something about which you no little or even if you "don't know what the **** you are talking about", then you can post a question (as opposed to remaining silent). That is a novel idea isnt it?
4) Here on planet Earth, asking and answering questions is a commonly used method of sharing information. But unfortunately, productive communication is occasionally interrupted by insecure people that we call ***h0les. I am sure you are familiar with people like that on your planet.
Do you ever go to the Malone's Wednesday mixer or other SHExpat events? It would be nice to put a face to such a special online personality as yourself. Have a nice day. |
Now that you've had your rant, weld that dunce cap to your head. Sometime in the year 2031 when your IQ raises above the single digit range think of having to removed.
Have a nice day, fucktard. |
|
|
|
|
|
teezy123
Seeker
Joined: Mar 21, 2008
Posts: 70
Status: Offline
|
| Posted:
Aug 14, 2008 - 11:31 PM |
|
|
Aw, I hurt your feelings didnt I. I'm sorry, I promise I wont do it again. |
|
|
|
|
|
underh20
Shanghai Royalty
Joined: Sep 27, 2006
Posts: 9905
Location: EOA Seminar
|
| Posted:
Aug 15, 2008 - 11:04 AM |
|
|
Now that you've proven what a fucktard you are, please don't take your frustrations out on your primary school students. Feel free to come back here and vent at any time ... we enjoy dumb-ass clowns like you. Gives people something to laugh about. |
_________________
بارك الله ، بارك الله |
|
|
|
|
|
|
Forum FAQ
Search
Preferences
Watched Topics
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
