Shanghai Expat :: View topic - Foreign Kids in Local Schools

Shanghai Expat

Family Life and Kids - Foreign Kids in Local Schools

A-roaming - Nov 29, 2007 - 07:31 AM
Post subject: Foreign Kids in Local Schools

Local schools

Hi!

We're thinking of moving to Shanghai for one or two years in the fall and are looking for advice about local schools for our kids. I have tried to read the threads here, but most of the commentary centers on the international schools. Have any of you had success with the local schools? How about problems? Can you recommend any particular local schools?

For reference, I have two kids, who will be 7 and 9 (second and fourth grade) next year. They speak Mandarin and are learning to read and write; they are roughly at grade level. (I'm not concerned about the English instruction they will get while we live in Shanghai because they are native speakers and well ahead of their peers.) The rationale of the move is for my kids to solidify their Chinese on a daily basis with Chinese kids, so the international schools don't appeal. Do the local kids mostly speak Shanhainese outside of the classroom?

Given the comments here, I have one main concern: the rigidity/rigor of the local school system. I don't like this approach to education for my kids but think it will not wilt them over just one year. How long is the school day? How much homework? Also, my kids are not Asian--are there bullying issues for such kids in local schools?

Are there other concerns I should have?

Last, I've heard the Taiwanese educational system is more progressive than the Chinese one. What Shanghai school is popular among Taiwanese expats?

sbergman - Nov 29, 2007 - 09:45 AM
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What about the local schools? - A Shanghainese friend of ours tried to encourage us to enroll our children in the local schools. Her children (half Chinese/half American) had been in the local schools for many years before transferring to Concordia for high school. The kids spoke Chinese at home and were fluent. When the mom left the room, her son said to my husband, "You can do that but your kids will hate you for it." I'm sure other people will recount better experiences though.

At many of the international schools, children without any Chinese or Asian ancestry are rare. Many of the children hold foreign passports but speak Chinese at home (or Japanese or Korean).

Where do the Taiwanese kids go? - SMIC has a large Taiwanese population. The kids have Chinese every day - which is great. On the downside, they are not allowed to speak Chinese outside of Chinese class, so there aren't many opportunities for the kids to just absorb Chinese around them.

Will the kids be bullied? I don't know about bullied but profoundly aware that they are different. My young daughter asked if she could shave her legs because her classmates gave her a hard time about having hair on her arms and legs. They occasionally call her "whitey." It's nothing terrible and I consider it character building and will help her to be sensitive when she's back in the majority, but it's there.

I have been told that the best way to get your kids to learn Chinese is to bring them here as young as possible, hire a Chinese ayi, and encourage the kids to spend time with and speak with the ayi.

Also, remember that every day your kids will be out of their element. A new home, a new town, a place where they are constantly aware that they are different. You might want them to be at a school that knows how to deal with that. The Singapore school might be a good alternative or Ping He - the Chinese school that is the choice of locals with the money to afford private school.

ciwei - Nov 29, 2007 - 10:58 PM
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Hello A-roaming. Here's our experience, for what it's worth.

Our daughter is in second grade at a local school. She's a "joint venture" (Chinese-Caucasion) and doesn't experience any bullying but she's pretty sociable. In fact I think she sometimes gets away with a little more and is made a bit of a fuss of because she is "foreign" (I think the only one in the school.) I'm not sure how much Shanghainese is spoken but I think it's discouraged. Certainly our daughter has never shown any desire to speak any Shanghainese.

As for the schooling itself, it is tough. The school day is from 7.50 to 3.30 and she gets about 2 hours of homework each day (at least, it takes her 2 hours). The schoolday is actually 40 minutes shorter than last year as I believe the government mandated a shorter day to reduce the pressure on children. Mom spends a lot of time every day helping our daughter with her Chinese homework and you'll definitely need someone who can help your children with this. She was fluent in Mandarin before she started school and could read a fair amount of Chinese, although not write any, but the local kids seem to have been preparing for school from about the age of 4, so I think she was actually a little behind at least as far as writing goes. I think your 9 year old especially would struggle unless he/she is reading and writing Chinese at close to the local standard. I also wouldn't expect any help from the school in catching up. The style of teaching is very rigid and doesn't seem to cater for individual needs. The maths standard also seems to be fairly high - at least a lot tougher than when I was at school. Having said this, the school she is at is supposed to be a bit tougher than average but I don't think other good local schools would be that much easier.

I don't actually regret the fact that she is at a local school but it's been heavy going at times and sometimes do wonder. My feeling is that she is getting a very good basic education and hopefully the ability to read and write Chinese will be something that sticks with her.

Hope this helps a little.

Regards
ciwei

tnmom - Nov 30, 2007 - 08:15 AM
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Quote:

Last, I've heard the Taiwanese educational system is more progressive than the Chinese one. What Shanghai school is popular among Taiwanese expats?

Lots of Taiwanese expats at the American School - they want to go to university in the US.

Adam7 - Nov 30, 2007 - 05:24 PM
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At a younger age I think it's fine, our kid has been in a local kindergarten. But I would not do it at ages 7 and 9, especially not to start at that age.

Do they speak Chinese all day, everyday? To pick up the language, learn the system and keep up with the school work would be quite a challenge for a kid.

There is a local school in Pudong that has an English stream, that would be a better option.

A-roaming - Dec 01, 2007 - 03:38 AM
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Many thanks to all of you for your helpful advice.

Hello, Ciwei. It's encouraging to hear your success story! It sounds like a local school would be great for us, if my kids are up to speed in terms of reading and writing Chinese (I will need to have them evaluated.). The lockstep educational approach and all that homework don't sound ideal, but it will only be for a year or two--and thanks for the heads-up on tutors: we'll need one. Do you have any say in which local school your kid goes to or are they assigned automatically based on catchment areas? If there is choice, how did you go about it? What kind of school should we avoid?

Hi, Sbergman. My impression (from posts and websites) is that the Chinese track at SMIC would provide a better focus on Chinese than the Singapore school or Pinghe (they seem to have a special section for foreigners, which defeats the purpose for us, and it also seems to be boarding only). It's a shame SMIC bans Chinese outside the classroom. Is your child in the English or Chinese track? How is his/her Chinese? Otherwise, how do you like the school?

Adam, do you plan on keeping your child at a local school after kindergarten?

Anyone else out there with kids in the Chinese track at SMIC? How is your child doing?

Best regards

jkahv - Dec 01, 2007 - 04:47 AM
Post subject: To the OP:

A-roaming:

If you can read Chinese, a Taiwanese expat forum might be worth visiting: www.TaiMaClub.com (Tai: Taiwanese, Ma: mothers.)

Many Taiwanese families sent their children to local schools. Some chose local "bilingual schools." My children speak very little Chinese and aren't small anymore so they can only attend an international school.

I've recently visited the SMIC School and Yew Chung Pudong. I didn't know that the SMIC discouraged students from speaking Chinese outside the classroom. It appears that Asians are in the majority at the SMIC school while Yew Chung's student population is more diverse. Yew Chung has a strong Chinese program and the SMIC School-English Track offers a Chinese class once a day. I looked at both schools' Chinese textbooks and they aren't easy at all.

Good luck!

StMichael - Dec 01, 2007 - 10:00 AM
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I have a friend whose children are (or has been - the eldest is now in Concordia) in Pinghe. Yes, they do have boarding facilities, but it is not necessary for your children to stay in campus. My friend's children goes home every day (it helps, I guess, that she has a car and driver for them).

The Singapore School may have a majority of lessons in English, but we offer 4 tracks of Chinese - the local Chinese syllabus (native standard), the Singapore Higher Chinese syllabus (near-native standard), the local CSL syllabus (Chinese as Second Language) and Basic Chinese (for those with no language background). While we only offer about an hour of Chinese a day, we do have an hour of Chinese Culture a week, and Music and Art are taught in Chinese. Our children generally bilingual in English and Chinese, though each nationality has its preferred language (Singaporeans and Malaysian = English, Taiwanese = Chinese and so on).

Hmm...my boss had better give me a raise for crossing over to marketing as well! Heh.

crystal_lss - Dec 01, 2007 - 11:41 AM
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Hi Ciwei,

Could you kindly let me know which local school that you chose for your daughter? Thanks.

Crystal

ciwei wrote:

sbergman - Dec 01, 2007 - 01:37 PM
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Re. your questions about SMIC:

My children are in the English track. My daughter thinks that foreigners with good enough Chinese could be in the Chinese track but I don't know that for sure. Only the English track kids have to abide by the "no Chinese" rule but, I've been corrected, they can speak Chinese at lunch. I do believe that there's a rule that kids in the Chinese track can transfer to the English track when their English is good enough but not v.v. I'm not sure that it would be worth paying tuition for the Chinese track as you can probably find just as good of instruction in one of the better local schools for a cheaper price.

To answer your other questions - My children arrived speaking no Chinese but my husband is fluent which as been a great help with homework.

We are very happy with the school. It has a bit of a missionary population which we were unaware of when we enrolled but it has not been a big issue for us. It is an issue though for some of the teachers who signed on not knowing about this and some seem to leave each year because of their discomfort. I think it's a bigger issue if you live near campus, which we don't. There is a lot of homework (2-3 hours/per night) but that seems to be the norm here.

Best of luck with your decision. As I'm sure you know, education is a huge priority for the Chinese so there are many good options.

chingy - Dec 01, 2007 - 04:38 PM
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I don't think the Chinese track at SMIC would be as rigorous as the average public in Shanghai. I am sure that there is still a lot of homework but just less so than a local school. This is just what I gather from a couple of teachers that we know at the school.

The one hour of Chinese in the English track is not enough to get your kids speaking Chinese. Most of the students in the English track are not native English speakers (e.g. Chinese, Korean) so learning English is the priority.

SMIC can be hit or miss depending on your child's teacher. There are some excellent teachers at the school but there are also some inexperienced teachers as well. Given the rapid turnover of teachers it is highly like you could have a great experience one year and a horrible experience the next.

GoPlayer - Dec 01, 2007 - 05:12 PM
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My son is in the international section in Pinghe. A-roaming, the term "foreigner" is misleading, most children are Asian and many of them are native Mandarin speakers - Taiwanese or Chinese back from the US. Mandarin is the usual language, except for the English and science classes. Boarding is optional.

We have been considering moving to a local school, but what holds us back is that chinese teachers are known to be harsh. We don't like the idea of our son being insulted in front of his classmates.

StMichael - Dec 01, 2007 - 11:01 PM
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GoPlayer wrote:

A-roaming, the term "foreigner" is misleading, most children are Asian and many of them are native Mandarin speakers - Taiwanese or Chinese back from the US.

I don't understand why "foreigner" is misleading - "foreigner" simply means someone who's not from China. HK and Macau SAR belongs to this category, as do Taiwan. As long as you do not hold the Chinese passport, you are lumped under the category of "foreigner".

hautumncloud - Dec 01, 2007 - 11:58 PM
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^^^ Its misleading because when one sees the word "foreigner" in a Chinese school, one would expect non-Chinese or at least non-native Chinese speakers as the obvious difference in the different category. If passports/citizenships are the only difference, in reality, there isn't much point in adding the word "foreigner" section, would there?

StMichael - Dec 02, 2007 - 12:02 AM
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Ah...you don't understand Chinese politics, hautumncloud, Smile

There is a reason why international schools are NOT allowed to take in Chinese citizens (except with special approval from the Education Board), even though tons of Chinese citizens can pay for it and want their children in. It's the same reason why it took so long for the local public schools to be opened to "foreigners".

How does the States define an "alien"? By the passports. It's the same thing. Smile

A-roaming - Dec 02, 2007 - 05:12 AM
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GoPlayer,

Thanks for your explanation. What percentage of the kids in the Pinghe international section are native Mandarin speakers? The website says the emphasis is on teaching English, so I imagine the focus is on getting non-English speakers up to speed, while maintaining some level of Mandarin reading and writing. Is that fair to say? Are you happy with the amount of Chinese instruction? How does the level of Mandarin instruction compare to local schools?

I think our goals (placing the kids in a Mandarin-speaking environment for both play and academics) might be at odds with those of most Pinghe parents.

We have the same concern about harshness in local schools that you have. Perhaps one year of it will be bearable given the other benefits. Friends from both Taiwan and the mainland have told us their elementary teachers were "cruel" and "humiliating," so I guess we've been warned.

Michael,

I think GoPlayer was just making clear to me, a newbie, that many "foreign" kids (at certain schools including Pinghe) are actually native Mandarin speakers (though this is not necessarily the case at other schools), whatever their passports might say.

GoPlayer - Dec 02, 2007 - 10:09 AM
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I'm talking about culture and education here, not passports.

The difference I make is that Chinese and some bilingual schools will treat the students as native speakers, while schools targeting foreigners will teach "Chinese as a Foreign Language". The same happens in the US for English.

I'll see if I can get some numbers for Pinghe. In my son's class, only two boys are "whitey", but still both are half-chinese.

The Chinese curriculum is supposed to be the same in the international and in the Chinese section, but I don't know how they compare in practice. My wife, who is Chinese and native Mandarin speaker, seems to be quite happy with the result.
On the other hand, the English level is not very good in average, the class is not homogeneous. Some kids are bilingual while others barely understand what the English teacher says.

A-roaming, my goal is the same as yours. Again, with a local school I am concerned that my son will find himself in an environment he is not prepared for. For example he can't stand that people spit.
Nevertheless I am still investigating this option. Some local public schools also have an international section, I would expect them to be closer to Western culture. Adam7, would you mind sharing the name and address of the school you are referring to?

Taiwanese or Singaporean schools might be an option, but I have not investigated this for financial reasons.

StMichael - Dec 02, 2007 - 10:37 AM
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GoPlayer wrote:

On the other hand, the English level is not very good in average, the class is not homogeneous. Some kids are bilingual while others barely understand what the English teacher says.

My friend from HK, whose kids are in Pinghe, is herself bilingual, and her children attend Sunday School every Sunday, so obviously they have an advantage in English standards over the Chinese kids.

I had one kid whose mother transferred him to my school, from a "bilingual" school (Xiehe). He could manage a conversation with me, and could understand my school's Grade 3 books (he was supposed to be Grade 6), when I interviewed him, two years ago.

It is tough when you do not have the proper language environment, even though the school claims bilingualism. My firstborn could hardly string a sentence in Chinese when he was in Singapore, even though our environment was supposed to be bilingual (sorry, but his parents tend to converse in English, so...). Here in China, his piano, swimming and taekwondo teachers teach in Chinese, and his ayi can only speak Chinese. My two boys are *really* bilingual now, able to switch between both languages effortlessly (to the relief of their father).

Quote:

Some local public schools also have an international section, I would expect them to be closer to Western culture.

The only local schools with international divisions, which I am aware have good English standards and more "westernised", would be Shanghai High and SMIC. I am not aware of others.

StMichael - Dec 02, 2007 - 10:40 AM
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A-roaming wrote:

I think GoPlayer was just making clear to me, a newbie, that many "foreign" kids (at certain schools including Pinghe) are actually native Mandarin speakers (though this is not necessarily the case at other schools), whatever their passports might say.

Either native (Taiwanese) or near-native (HK, Macau and Singaporeans). Just because we are ethnic Chinese does not mean Mandarin is native to us, especially children from English-speaking countries like Singapore, and Cantonese-speaking countries like HK and Macau.

ciwei - Dec 02, 2007 - 02:52 PM
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Hello A-roaming and crystal_lss - I have PM'd you both with more information

Regards
ciwei

yu888 - Dec 03, 2007 - 12:25 PM
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Growing up ethnic Chinese in many places does not necessarily mean native mandarin speaker. The "misleading" part of the term "foreigner" is that most expats tend to forget that most expats here in Shanghai are ethnic Asian and MAY have a slight advantage in certain cases, but certainly the term "foreign" is used correctly to describe these schools and their enrollment; it is our responsibility as a community to make sure newcomers understand that a large segment of the expat community is Asian-based.

sbergman - Dec 03, 2007 - 01:15 PM
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I think it's also important to make the distinction because there is a sizable number of children with Chinese parents who hold American passports. Yes, the children are American but that may just mean that their mother happened to live in the States on the day the child was born. Some of these children have not attended schools elsewhere, may or may not speak other languages, etc.

In my original post I meant this in a positive way. If you are looking for an opportunity for your child to meet and make friends with Chinese-speaking friends, you may be able to find that within the context of an international school.

A-roaming - Dec 13, 2007 - 07:38 AM
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We've decided to aim for a local school (private or public), with SMIC and Pinghe as backups.

But I'm confused about the international tracks at some local schools. Is that just a separate track for non-Chinese passport holders? Or is it for local Chinese who want more English?

As mentioned, the only real downside to a local school (for us) is the old-fashioned educational approach. Are some local schools more progressive than others? Do experimental schools have a more progressive approach?

StMichael - Dec 13, 2007 - 05:21 PM
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The international tracks are meant for those whose passports are NOT issued by the mainland Chinese government.

HK2ShviaUSA - Dec 13, 2007 - 08:35 PM
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A-roaming, you have gotten alot of advice and alot of info to wade thru.

From my understanding, there are several (138 last count) local schools that are able to take foreign passport holders. Of these schools, many have international divisions - some that teach in english, some that teach in chinese - all with one period in the alternative language.

My native english speaking kids have been in HK local cantonese schools. So before we moved here, we were looking for chinese schools (I tutor english at home). I was only looking in Pudong.

I found Golden Apple (most kids board, 40 kids per class, kids were happy and enthusiastic), SMIC Chinese division (small classes at less than 20, slightly depressing environment but I went in the middle of winter, nice campus), Pinghe International Division (2 periods of english, depressing atmosphere, teachers defecting, very inflexible attitude, and no 4th grade class at the time). Discount any international school (including previously mentioned Yew Chung IS) since 1 period of chinese a day is what they offer.

when my kids took the test for SMIC, my daughter got a 38 (testing into 4th grade)! OK, so there was a traditional to simplifed issue at hand, but.... They recommended my daughter and son (testing into 2nd grade - got a 9!!!!) both drop a grade. They had both been doing B - A work in HK cantonese school. The chinese in China is difficult and the words they are expected to know is antiquated (and not the same style as HK or Singapore).

Expect that any school that has alot of Chinese or Taiwanese, the parents are clamouring for more homework and think it's weird if there is no homework!

Since moving to SH, my friend's son goes to a school in Lujiazhui that teaches in Chinese using the local curriculum, 1 period of english a day, takes only foreigners into this section, and is slightly better attitude than your typical local school since the mom told me that there are quite a few bi-culturals and westerns. Still, he has quite a bit of HW every night (2 hrs every night and that was 2nd grade). It is right near Yanlord Garden.

Don't know how many kids in each class but it sounds like what you are looking for. That or Golden apple or SMIC/Chinese track. pm me if you need the exact details.

HK2ShviaUSA - Dec 13, 2007 - 09:07 PM
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Quote:

The Chinese curriculum is supposed to be the same in the international and in the Chinese section, but I don't know how they compare in practice.

Pinghe uses the same books....it is not the same expectation. I'm guessing smaller classes. I think they told me something like that kids that were NOT doing well in the local stream (at 1,200rmb or less a month) were recommended to go to the international stream (6,000+ rmb per month)

Shanghai High School International Division teaches exclusively in English (with some local teachers that speak with a heavy accent and in one friend's instance, none of the teachers were native english speakers) with chinese as a subject.

Quote:

I don't think the Chinese track at SMIC would be as rigorous as the average public in Shanghai. I am sure that there is still a lot of homework but just less so than a local school.

The kids at SMIC chinese section take the same standardized as the local kids in SH. In addition, the taiwanese parents are just as demanding as the local chinese parents about HW, if not more. They are concerned that when they go back to Taiwan, the kids will not be behind. When my daughter was being tutored to re-take the exam, she had to study from both the standard local text and a supplemental chinese textbook (like one was not enough!) - which I don't think they do in the local schools.

BTW, if you are gearing up your kids, I would HIGHLY recommend getting the standard chinese textbook to study up (available in any school supply book store - make sure you do get the right one as there are several series, but only 1 that is highly locally regarded). They are really CHEAP at 26rmb per semester, with workbooks and sometimes audio tapes (1st and 2nd grade).

guest13 - Dec 14, 2007 - 10:08 PM
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I am living in pudong side,does anyone heard JIN CAI school? some of the kids in our compound goes there. its at Lian Yang area,its local school with international stream. i went there had a look at international class. most of them are asian,with a few westerner kids. any information? thanks.

HK2ShviaUSA - Dec 15, 2007 - 01:15 AM
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Has reputation....as least on the radar. Don't know anyone who sends there kids there. Read in a book that their english level was low. Your kids would be in the english stream.....with a whole bunch of chinese speaking kids (at lunch, outside schools). Since you are paying for the international section...how many of the teachers are teaching english (of of those, how many are native english speakers?). Anyway, isn;t this thread about getting a chinese education?

Typical school marketing ploy. Take your only blond blue eyed kid and stick them in most of the school web site photos.

StMichael - Dec 15, 2007 - 10:57 AM
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Hmm...isn't Jin Cai a high school only? I've been there before, when attending an IB course (they do the IB, apparently).

RachaelLau - Dec 15, 2007 - 11:21 PM
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It has been close to 3 months since I started teaching English in a local Chinese school. As I don't station there (I only go to the school twice a week when I have lessons) or kids studying in local school, I am not aware of their workload.

But besides academics and languag, I just want to comment on the emotional and cultural aspect.

Its a norm to see teachers pulling student's ear and putting them down. If your kids have never experience it back in their own country. Please tell them don't take it personlly. Its just the culture.

I believe many have heard that local students are very respectful and attentive in class (because they have to sit up straight with hands behind). But that is only half the story. This is only true when a teacher is around. But once behind the teacher's back, they don't talk, they generally "shout" to get their voice across. I guess they pick it up from their parents and teachers. And yes, teachers in my school shout alot.

I used to think like that when my daughter goes to primary school, I would send her to a local school. But after my experience, I think I will think twice.

But having said that, I still love my kids back in the local school. Its just that culturally, we are very different.

Then again, if you are staying around Gubei, you can perhaps visit Jian Qing Shi Yan School. It's a very good school.

hautumncloud - Dec 17, 2007 - 12:15 PM
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RachaelLau wrote:

But besides academics and languag, I just want to comment on the emotional and cultural aspect.

Its a norm to see teachers pulling student's ear and putting them down. If your kids have never experience it back in their own country. Please tell them don't take it personlly. Its just the culture.

That is physical & verbal abuse no matter what culture it is. Just how the said culture tolerate the abuse is the question.

HK2ShviaUSA - Dec 17, 2007 - 12:26 PM
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My son's teacher has called my son a liar (he didn't) and told him his project was unacceptable and 'terrible' (actually, I thought is was perfectly acceptable for 3rd grade and certainly something he did by himself and was something that he was proud of).

I would not expect any teacher (esp in primary school) to say anyone's work was terrible...I expect constructive criticism (like add some photos, you need a title page, you need to expand your essay, I want a cover, etc.) esp when something was handed in a week early! Besides, I read her instructions and I couldn't figure out what she wanted . He got a chance to turn in the project again (minus 10 points for being late) but it looked nothing like her written expectation and probably everything that she wanted.

Oh, did I mention that she's north american? And yes, we are in the international division of a local school. Which then speaks of the uneven teachers that your kids might encounter. And then you might have no recourse, since there might be only one class per grade.

sbergman - Dec 17, 2007 - 02:45 PM
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Anyone who can speak English can teach here. It's harder to find jobs at the international schools if you truly have no experience but, even there, when it gets down to the crunch and someone renegs on their contract at the last minute, people get hired who have questionable experience. As you move down the feeding chain of Shanghai schools, the problem gets worse. At one of the international kindergartens, my daughter's class cycled through three English teachers over the course of the year and I don't think any of them had ever had an Early Childhood Ed class. The only saving grace was that the Chinese teacher was trained and good.

My sense is that the American and European schools are more sensitive to criticism from parents and will correct a bad hiring as quickly as they can. I think Asian culture is such that it's harder to deal with bad hirings in the Asian and local schools

RachaelLau - Dec 18, 2007 - 11:13 PM
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Whatever it is, let's just say it takes time to change. Last summer, I was in Shenyang doing a summercamp. The ministry was there almost everyday to observe and video tape how we conduct our classes in a more positive and creative way. And there are still many exchange program going on. One of the major items of discussion is how to use more positive learning in classroom teaching.

But as a mother, I guess I am still selfish. If I can afford. I would still choose not to place my daughter in this environment.

HK2ShviaUSA - Dec 19, 2007 - 11:53 AM
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My son get enough of the toughness at home (from me. LOL. And I would never say his work is terrible, I would praise him for his effort and give ideas for improvement!). I paid tuition so that my kids will have a positive learning experience and love learning, not so they ask to stay home from school.

fuyu_jinjin - Jan 13, 2008 - 11:48 PM
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so if a high school student wants to take a Chinese Section in an Int'l school ( if have) but cannot speak Chinese, which school suits him?
Thanks for any input.

HK2ShviaUSA - Jan 14, 2008 - 09:01 AM
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All international schools (not the international section of a chinese school) should have CSL for beginners. You should find out if it is you or your child that wants to take chinese. Some programs concentrate heavily in reading/writing, which means if you child is not so much into it, your child might be turned off.

If the purpose is to understand/speak a few phrases, make sure that if you are looking at the international section of a chinese school, that they have beginner classes (CSL) or extra help.

fuyu_jinjin - Jan 14, 2008 - 10:21 PM
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Thanks HK2ShviaUSA,
I visited Jincai Int'l Division School (Pudong) once and I don't really like it (because of some silly reasons and also they gave a entrance test with a lots a wrong questions which impossible to have any answers). However, because I want to attend to CSL program or English Section with extra-help on Chinese(?). Anyway, the main point is I want to study in China and go to a Chinese university but my Chinese level is 0. My parents don't want me to miss any school year ( if I choose CSL, I might stay back 1 year or if I choose English Section, it's just like what I'm doing now just without chance to learn Chinese.) So, does anyone know anything about Jincai?And it just has IB for junior students. 2 schools I try to contact and apply are SMIC and Fudan. One thing makes me confused is both Fudan and SMIC I like and I think it they suit me in some ways have no IB programs.
Thanks!

Portsmouth - Jan 16, 2008 - 09:10 AM
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For parents tempting to send their children to local schools, below is a good article from Shanghai Daily.

I showed the article to my local co-worker who is a mother of a 6 year-old first grader and she could not agree more with the author that "he will be constantly ranked in accordance with his score, which then dictates the amount of respect and kindness he will get from his teachers and classmates."

----------------------------------------------
Pupils are wrecks but the system grinds on
Created: 2008-1-16
Author:Wan Lixin

ONE noted scholar once remarked that the youth today are no longer capable of experiencing intense feelings, whether the ecstasies of joy or the depths of sorrow.

But recently some students were moved to tears by a text depicting the vicissitudes experienced by Fan Jin.

Excerpted from the classic novel "The Scholars," the story relates how Fan, long held in contempt by his family and relatives, succeeds in the provincial examination at the age of 54. He goes mad upon hearing the news.

The examination success also results in a dramatic elevation in the estimation of Fan, particularly by his father-in-law Butcher Hu, who used to abuse him.

"There were faint sobs while the teacher was going through the text. Quite a few students were in tears, just like me ..." thus wrote Xiao Yu, a junior high school student in Shenyang, Liaoning Province, in his diary.

Xiao Yu explained that the readers were so sympathetic because they themselves are all too familiar with types like Butcher Hu in their own lives.

The "good" students, or those good at getting high scores, are pampered and fawned over by the teachers and the students alike, in spite of their defects in other respects.

The "bad" students are perennial victims of prejudice, disdain, and neglect.

But the similarities between Fan and today's young scholars are limited.

First, only a very small minority chose to distinguish themselves through studies in Fan's time, while today almost none can be spared the ordeal.

Second, Fan at 54 had sat for about 20 examinations, which was only a fraction of the number endured by a student today at age 10.

There is also one fundamental difference: Fan's studies were largely self-motivated and self-managed, because at his time there was no orthodox curriculum and national syllabus, or standardized tests.

Today school cramming is institutionalized, compulsory, and begins from pre-school years.

One of my nephews in north Jiangsu is cramming for this year's National College Entrance Examination; he leaves home at 5:30am and returns home at 10:30pm, almost every day for the past three years.

This is the test of tests and it reduces individuals infinitely diverse in their temperaments and aspirations to a fatal numerical score.

The message has been hammered home to students that any letting-up in their efforts will cost them the race.

As if they were professional sports people, who are constantly reminded that the medal has to be won, at whatever cost.

The health and psychological costs are considerable, when you know the number of students who end up traumatized.

I remember scholar Qian Mu once noted that intensifying competition determines that our society is churning out human wrecks.

Almost all are losers. Depending on the context, one winner will emerge in a class, a school, a field, a nation.

Individual resistance can be futile.

For instance, my five-year old son is attending a kindergarten known for its English teaching, but so far we have managed to show little concern over his ignorance compared with his classmates. We have successfully deflected the attentions of salespersons who intend to prey on his weekends and vacations.

But our protection can go only as far as elementary school, where he will be constantly ranked in accordance with his score, which then dictates the amount of respect and kindness he will get from his teachers and classmates.

When everyone else is hell-bent on revving up their scores, those who dare to take a laissez-faire attitude are, as one parent said, "subjecting their kid to a pack of wolves."

The really sensible parents, rather than shield them, should teach them how to live with wolves.

I heard from one of my colleagues that one couple, obviously taking a liberal view of education, would not hear of any private schooling for their kid. To their great dismay, their child failed to enter a key school.

Thus, unless the so-called jianfu (unloading) is a nationally-coordinated move, those who dare to take the initiative are veritable dummies.

This explains why repeated efforts at unloading all end up as short-lived farces.

Remedy elusive

Late last November the education department in Wuhan, Hubei Province, promulgated a total of 17 decrees aimed at relieving students' burden.

The decrees, acclaimed as highly doable, aimed to reduce the burden by regulating study hours, home assignments, the times of examinations, the number of competitive events, and the practice of private tutoring.

Just one month after they went into effect, the decrees had failed. This outcome did not surprise the education experts, teachers and parents.

From elementary school on, nearly all teachers are subjected to quantitative assessment, which essentially means linking the average class test results with the teachers' earnings.

The only way to achieve quick results in this race for high scores, thus good earnings, is to involve students in incessant problem-solving.

Many teachers and parents are keenly aware that this pedagogy is destroying their students and children, both mentally and physically.

But even the most liberal-minded teachers dare not do what's right for the kids, encumbered as they are by their own big family to support.

Who dares to challenge the establishment by sacrificing the welfare of their family?

sbergman - Jan 16, 2008 - 10:37 AM
Post subject:

Interesting post. When I taught at Fudan, the system also encouraged rampant cheating. After all, if the school and the teachers are being judged by the scores - don't you want the students to do everything possible to score high? Even if it includes turning a blind eye to answers being written on desks or people bringing in notes they shouldn't have. My students would tell me that you have to use all the tools available to you to succeed an that being good at cheating was also a skill.

I have grown to be much more appreciative of the role of the arts and sports in education since I have been here. Not only are they important in teaching children that no one can succeed alone (even the Bill Gateses of the world need companies of people to back them up) but they also help students to see and appreciate the variety of talents that people may bring to the table. I don't think it's coincidence that the Chinese are best at individual sports and not team sports.

fuyu_jinjin - Jan 16, 2008 - 10:08 PM
Post subject:

sbergman wrote:

excuse me, Mr Sbergman, when you said Fudan, did you mean university or high/international school. I want to study in Shanghai for high school but have difficulties choosing schools. When I took a look at Fudan international school, I thought it is a good school. Since you said that, can you please tell me elaborately and may you give me some advices about schools in Shanghai. Please also notes that my Chinese is not good, actually just beginner. Thank you a lot.
Best regards.

sbergman - Jan 16, 2008 - 10:28 PM
Post subject:

I meant University and it was awhile ago. I've heard only good things about their high school. If your Chinese isn't very good, you might consider an international school that offers Chinese language or a Chinese immersion program during the summer.

guest13 - Jan 19, 2008 - 09:54 PM
Post subject:

Do you mind I ask which school your kid goes? since my daughter is over 5,i am checking around all the schools in pudong.. prefer local private school with international division. thanks.

HK2ShviaUSA wrote:

guest13 - Jan 19, 2008 - 09:58 PM
Post subject:

do you mind i ask how old are you? since i am actually thinking about send my daughter to JIN CAI int'l Division. thanks.

fuyu_jinjin wrote:

RachaelLau - Jan 21, 2008 - 06:41 PM
Post subject:

fuyu_jinjin,

Too bad I too ignorant to give you any suggestion on choosing your ideal high school, but I just want to say I am impressed by your interest in looking out for a good school yourself. We hardly had any "kids" who is interested in "school" topic. Its always the parents who are so excited about school:> Good luck to you. I think you will learn fast because of your good attitude.

Portsmouth, I read with interest on the article. There is actually another way to go to a good school without putting so much effort. Its open secret that people goes through back door. Everyone speak so publicly without any shame. Maybe, it further reduce the chance for students who work hard. Beside fighting for grades, they are also fighting or students with money to pay throug the back door! How unfair!!

fuyu_jinjin - Jan 27, 2008 - 09:53 PM
Post subject:

@RachaelLau: Thanks^^
I just dont know if I should go to CHina at this time, in the middle of the schoolyear. Also, which is better, Fudan or SMIC?

rucksack - Feb 13, 2008 - 01:04 PM
Post subject:

I am interested in anyone who knows the difference between experimental local schools and regular local schools. My son has been in local kindergarten for 3-1/2 years and loves it. It's an experimental school, whatever that means, he is one of 2 foreigners in his grade but there are also a couple in tuo-ban and in da-ban. Anyhow, his teachers are very kind and gentle in their discipline, more patient than I am. After reading some of the above about the treatment of the students in primary school, I am feeling a bit freaked. I have a friend who has her child in first grade in local school and the child loves school. How much depends on the school? On the teacher? I'm really worried about physical and mental abuse.

StMichael - Feb 13, 2008 - 01:49 PM
Post subject:

It's the same everywhere - it depends on the school administration (leadership) and the actual teacher you get. There are gems and rocks everywhere.

From what I know, experimental schools are given more leeway with their curriculum and syllabus, compared to the standard local schools.

sww - May 11, 2008 - 08:39 AM
Post subject:

Hi, am interested in hearing more about the Fudan Experimental School. I hear it has a very strong curriculum in both English and Chinese and touts itself as being a better than your average "bilingual" school (spoken, not written).

likewater - June 09, 2008 - 07:39 PM
Post subject: Here's my suggestion

I'm an English teacher in Pin He bilingual school which is located in Jin Qiao district in Shanghai. I think it will be your good choice if you send your kids to our school:) We have kids coming from the different contries, some of them are studying in the local department with the Chinese kids, some of them are studying in the international department. But no matter which department you'll choose, we have experienced Chinese teachers and we speak mandarin to each other in our school:) Best wishes to you and your kids!

canuckian - June 10, 2008 - 11:36 AM
Post subject:

To simplify things, which of the following local schools would YOU recommend for foreign kids to attend at the elementary level:

SMIC
Ping He
Golden Apple
Jian Qing Shi Yan School

likewater - June 10, 2008 - 01:21 PM
Post subject:

Sure I would like to say: Pin He Smile

msittig - June 10, 2008 - 01:45 PM
Post subject:

Just to add my two cents, I would say that it depends. It's impossible to make a recommendation for all students in general. Visit the school, talk to the teachers and administrators, and find out for yourself.

likewater - June 10, 2008 - 07:21 PM
Post subject:

Hi Msittig, thanks for your reply. But as an experienced teacher for almost 18 years in different schools, I would say that it depends on the teachers. We can help all kinds of students academically and morally with our love and pro methods:) I have the confidence on that.[/u]

StMichael - June 10, 2008 - 09:03 PM
Post subject:

I'd disagree, likewater - each school has its own educational philosophy, and the teachers are supposed to teach to the educational philosophy. No matter how good a teacher is, if the parent does not like or believe in the philosophy, the parent will not and should not put their kids in the school.

msittig - June 10, 2008 - 09:42 PM
Post subject:

Quote:

I would say that it depends on the teachers

I agree, that's very important. That's why I said "talk to the teachers".

likewater - June 10, 2008 - 09:47 PM
Post subject:

I quite understand what you mean and you are right, it's the parents who choose the schools for their kids at last by their own judgement. Choosing the right school with the right educational philosophy is really very important to the parents. But in my opinion, what is more important to the kids is the quality of the teachers in those schools, which might ultimately influence them for a life time:) Good luck!

hautumncloud - June 10, 2008 - 10:21 PM
Post subject:

Choosing a school is much more than just having good teachers. A student may have a very good teacher who work well with him/her this year but next year there is no guarantee which teacher the student will get. Ultimately, the leadership of the school, philosophy of the school, goal of the school and curriculum which the school uses plays a very important role. Of all these, in my opinion, the leadership of the school is the one which will mold/keep the school/teachers/admin in track. It is the value that the leadership role in the school that eventually will trickle down to the students and attract teachers who fit into the school's criteria.

likewater - June 11, 2008 - 06:15 AM
Post subject:

That's for sure, hautumncloud. And I want to be that kind of leader myself in school one day:) That's also why I recommend Pin He to him since we have the professional leadership here full of vitality, enthusiasm and always keep the love to all of the students. We believe each one can be taught well, and it'll be the teacher's problem if the student fail in his study. Have a nice day!

StMichael - June 11, 2008 - 06:42 PM
Post subject:

hautumncloud wrote:

When I was teaching in Singapore, one of my client and friend told me that waiting for news on the child's form teacher for the next year is like waiting for the lottery. You pray each day that your child gets this particular teacher, and not that particular teacher, all the while knowing that it is not quite within your control which teacher your child gets.

With such high "stakes", no wonder it's a lottery!

rucksack - June 17, 2008 - 05:43 AM
Post subject:

canuckian wrote:

To simplify things, which of the following local schools would YOU recommend for foreign kids to attend at the elementary level:

SMIC
Ping He
Golden Apple
Jian Qing Shi Yan School

Oh my, there are so many more available.

msittig - June 17, 2008 - 10:27 AM
Post subject:

rucksack wrote:

Oh my, there are so many more available.

That's true, but the original poster was not asking about the others. Could you recommend some local schools besides those original four?

rucksack - June 18, 2008 - 11:32 AM
Post subject:

Qi Se Hua near Yan Dang Lu, New Era on Xing Guo Lu - there are more of course I have a listing from the internet.

msittig - June 18, 2008 - 12:28 PM
Post subject:

Interesting! So what sets it apart from other schools?

Actually my wife and I will send out daughter to a local preschool as well, so any advice you can give would be appreciated.

canuckian - June 18, 2008 - 01:51 PM
Post subject:

msittig wrote:

Interesting! So what sets it apart from other schools?

Actually my wife and I will send out daughter to a local preschool as well, so any advice you can give would be appreciated.

So do we. I believe there are many others available, but the discussion in this thread seems to evolve around those 4 schools. You're more than welcome to add on the list, rucksack.
Does your child enrolled in Qi Se Hua near Yan Dang lu or New Era on Xing Guo lu? What do you like about each school that is worth mentioning off the top of your head?

rucksack - June 19, 2008 - 05:44 AM
Post subject:

Those are primary schools and my child is just finishing Zhong Ban at his kindergarten. There's Aiju, another primary school with an international stream. Some primary schools offer international streams. The class size is smaller and the pace is slower. Of course it's more expensive, but nothing like an international school. I only know from second hand about the schools I mentioned. I have many friends with their kids in local schools so I hear from their experiences. Qi Se Hua is an art school. New Era is experimental. They have smaller classes relatively speaking and a mix of nationalities. You don't have to have a foreign passport. I have about 8 months before I decide on a school and I'm still looking around, new things turn up all the time. You never know if the local primary school close by has an international stream or not, they don't really advertise. It takes a lot of footwork, time and patience. It's a learning experience.

GoPlayer - June 19, 2008 - 03:28 PM
Post subject:

hautumncloud wrote:

A student may have a very good teacher who work well with him/her this year but next year there is no guarantee which teacher the student will get.

My son is in Ping He international section, and I think their policy is to have the home classroom teacher stay with the same class.
This year, my son had the same Chinese and math teachers as last year.

msittig - June 19, 2008 - 07:07 PM
Post subject:

Thanks for the tips, rucksack. I looked at Qisehua's website and their alumni page is certainly impressive, with lots of kids going on to study music at impressive middle schools.

elainelge - June 20, 2008 - 04:21 PM
Post subject:

HI do you have the website link? I can't seem to google it? Do you know what the fee structure is like?

msittig - June 20, 2008 - 05:12 PM
Post subject:

Actually I was looking at the wrong website. I had found Qisehua Preschool in Baoshan, but I think rucksack lives in Xuhui so she's probably talking about Qisehua Elementary School in Luwan:

http://www.qsh.lwedu.sh.cn

This site (http://jiwei.luwan.sh.cn/pop.asp?cid=82&nid=23) says that tuition was RMB 1500/semester in 2006. I'm fairly certain that's only for Shanghainese, and that it will be more expensive for foreign-passport holders.

elainelge - June 23, 2008 - 09:16 AM
Post subject:

Hi Thanks for the information, I will include these in my list to check out when I get to Shanghai. My thots is to find school first and then find place to stay! Thanks so very much!. I will keep a look out for any further comments from PARENTS on any schools to research. Any feedback is valuable.
Thanks!

New gal - July 05, 2008 - 10:18 PM
Post subject:

wow it seems like Ping He and Golden Apple are hot favourites.... does anyone know the websites of these 2 schools? Could you pls provide me the link? Thanks!

limme - July 06, 2008 - 12:56 AM
Post subject:

A-roaming I think your aim is for your children to pick up chinese. I think beside going to a local school there are plenty of other options.

Me and my wife are chinese origin (Taiwan and China). We migrated to Australia when we were 12 and 6 respectively.I actually went there by myself at 12 for study. The kids could hardly speak any chinese as we converse in English back at home (our mistake as we can speak chinese). As I went through 8 years of Asian education (Taiwanese style) and knowing the influence it has on me (rigid and spoon feeding) and later impacted part of my high school life in Australia, me and my wife decided to enrol them in international school.

After close to 2 years in China the kids pick up a lot of chinese and basically they can now converse in chinese even though writing is still a bit behind. Me and my wife are really please with the progress. They have chinese lesson in the international school plus we hire a tutor over the weekend (2 hours per day).

Just like what StMichael said earlier the ayi, tutor, music teacher,....... all speak chinese. It does force them to communicate in chinese Another big plus is that you have the environment here in china for them to learn chinese and in western countries the environment is not there.

I personally spend 8 years of education in Asia (Taiwan) and spend my high school + uni + research years in westren countries. Knowing the pro's and con's of both systems, you will need to assess the requirements of your children.

As parents we always believe the best way for children to learn something in life is at school. In fact there is a lot of other ways for children to learn beside learning in school.

At the end of the day there are thousand ways but you just need to assess the environment and requirements of your family and make the best choice for them.

PS:
My family spend 2 years in Vietnam before coming to Shanghai and the kids picked up more vietnamese than me and my wife and they still chat with their vietnamese friends on the internet using vietnamese. Kids are just liked sponge, they absorb very quickly. It just depends on how we teach them.

elainelge - July 07, 2008 - 06:20 PM
Post subject:

New gal wrote:

wow it seems like Ping He and Golden Apple are hot favourites.... does anyone know the websites of these 2 schools? Could you pls provide me the link? Thanks!

http://www.shphschool.com/english/1.htm - hi this is for Pinghe

if you google Gold Apple School Shanghai, you will find the site Smile

rucksack - Sep 04, 2008 - 02:54 PM
Post subject:

For me, one important criteria for my children to attend their local kindergarten is that the teachers do not treat them differently. Sometimes I hear a parent saying to their child,"say hello to the waiguoxiaopengyou". It's more than obvious my children are foreigners with blond hair and blue eyes. It's not necessary to hightlight the obvious. The children don't really seem to mind the difference, it's their parents that make such a big deal. Yesterday, I overheard one parent saying that waiguoxiaopengyou are very wanpi (naughty). Like.....Chinese children aren't?? What a statement. I'm more concerned about what the parents are saying to their kids, how they are influencing them. I don't want my kids to get bullied when they go on to local primary school just because they look different.
My oldest son recently went on a train trip to Changsha with his dad. He got on great with the kids on the train. The adults, even though they heard him speak Chinese perfectly, still made very insensitive comments to their kids about him in front of him. Derek obviously understood and had his feelings hurt. It's like he was some exotic animal. Then those kids started to say the same things that the adults were saying and Derek just fell apart. It happens even in Shanghai to a lesser extent.
Anyhow, some challenges to being a "whitey" child in China. And, my husband said, Hunan isn't ready for a Chinese speaking, caucasion child.

winpetung - Oct 04, 2008 - 07:56 PM
Post subject:

Have you checked out Shanghai Fudan-Vanke Experimental Private School in Minhang district? Their website is www.vks.cn

helloasia - Oct 19, 2008 - 12:44 AM
Post subject:

How about the preschool run by the Child Welfare Institute on Huashan Lu? Has anyone heard positive/negative things about it?

winpetung - Oct 22, 2008 - 05:45 AM
Post subject:

My son graduated from CWIN on HuaShan Lu. We had a very frustrating first year (xiao ban) there. He didn't want to go to school and the teachers, though senior staff, were terrible - I shall not discuss on the web. I was on the verge of taking him out of the school. However, he had a great form teacher in K1 (zhong ban) who continued with the class till the kids graduated.

My opinion is, like all schools, it depends on the teacher.

helloasia - Oct 22, 2008 - 07:32 AM
Post subject:

Hi winpetung,
THank you for your response! I just sent you a pm.
Helloasia.

lena79 - Mar 11, 2009 - 02:29 PM
Post subject:

Hello, I would like to add some from my experience.
My nephew is Chinese kid and we live in Jingsu province. The school name something like " ... Experimental School".

He is 14 years old 7th Grade I believe.
Typical day at school:
6 a.m. exercises
7-12 a.m. classes
12 p.m.-2p.m. lunch break
2-6 p.m. classes
6-9:25 p.m. homework under teacher supervision (must be)
Monday-Friday
Saturday till 4 p.m.
Sunday classes starts from 3 p.m.

If you will calculate kids spend 14 hours every day ( Adult working day is 8-10 hours)!
You can also let your child live at school. Bed will be provided in small room with 6 kids togerther. Last year after I have visited his dorm room I was very sad... Sometimes they do not have a hot water there. It is more like an army style or something!
On the other side campus is big and lvery nice, it has a playground etc, but the kids do not enjoy it, they simply do not have time. I was really depressed about all my findings, but my husband told me it is normal and OK, everywhere is the same.

Misteral - Mar 11, 2009 - 04:12 PM
Post subject:

Quote:

He is 14 years old 7th Grade I believe.
Typical day at school:
6 a.m. exercises
7-12 a.m. classes
12 p.m.-2p.m. lunch break
2-6 p.m. classes
6-9:25 p.m. homework under teacher supervision (must be)
Monday-Friday
Saturday till 4 p.m.
Sunday classes starts from 3 p.m.

Child cruelty in my books. Evil or Very Mad

And bloody awful for parents having to get their kid to school for that time in the morning.

Unfortunately, parents feel they have no choice but to comply with this type of regime considering the level of competition for university places and jobs that exists here. Primary schools are not much better, I hear the government are planning reform of the education system but don't hold your breathe for anything too radical.

Mental it all is.

airane - May 25, 2009 - 08:58 PM
Post subject:

how about Shanghai High School? Is it a good school for foreign student? We are from India, I am a bit worry about my kids may not be able to get along well with local students.

MattKC - May 25, 2009 - 09:28 PM
Post subject:

Yea, at a local school your kids will be faced with making friends with cliques that have been together since primary school. At an international school the kids are always being uprooted. They are all in the same situation. Also, I don't know much about school in India, but local high schools here are lacking in teaching critical thinking skills and organizing thought for essays and such.

you should watch the articles tab on the homepage. I heard a rumor that someone from SHExpat was working on an article about this.

partners - June 19, 2009 - 07:57 PM
Post subject:

hi all,
i like school and school is the place were oue kids are learn more thing releted with nature and your site is too good........

Otool2001 - July 28, 2009 - 10:48 PM
Post subject:

Just Curious but why would anyone wish to curse their children with the experience of a Chinese school? Ignoring the work load, the conditions are deplorable the classmates they would be likely to meet are spoiled little brats and the history they will come home and tell you about for the most part is Mao's wet dream.

StMichael - July 29, 2009 - 05:39 PM
Post subject:

Perhaps they have no choice due to the high-priced international schools here?

freedelia - Aug 12, 2009 - 04:23 AM
Post subject:

There is always home schooling... I would NEVER EVER put my kids in a Chinese school.

Klick - Aug 13, 2009 - 12:05 AM
Post subject:

How irritating is it though that the only real options are either home schooling or unbelieveably expensive international schools? Seriously, we are OK now with DD in a private local kindergarten but in two years she will need to go to 'big school', and it is probably the thing that will drive us out of Shanghai, unless DH's company can be persuaded that he is so invaluable and irreplaceable it is in their interests to give us lots of money for a decent school.

FTM - Aug 14, 2009 - 02:52 PM
Post subject:

I'm contemplating on sending my kid to a local school with an international scheme. There are some very good pro's to it. I've just started a search and have selected some schools in Xuhui and Pudong areas only. All are IB, either PYP/MYP/DP program. Check out www.ibo.org to make your own list.

Shanghai American School (Pudong Campus) [http://www.ibo.org/school/002763/]
Shanghai High School [http://www.ibo.org/school/000861/]
Shanghai Jin Cai High School [http://www.ibo.org/school/002633/]
Shanghai Pinghe School [http://www.ibo.org/school/001458/]
Shanghai Victoria Wah Kwong Kindergarten [http://www.ibo.org/school/002789/]
Shanghai World Foreign Language Middle School

It's such a difficult decision.

Good luck!

StMichael - Aug 14, 2009 - 03:06 PM
Post subject:

Uh...Shanghai American School is a "full-blooded" international school...

You missed out Xiehe (Shanghai United) and also Shanghai Normal University High (in Pudong).

FTM - Aug 14, 2009 - 06:08 PM
Post subject:

Right and thanks. I forgot to exclude SAS, but will add the 2 you mentioned to my list.

vprimush - Aug 18, 2009 - 02:37 PM
Post subject:

Hi Reacher,

What do you mean?
You still can send your children to good local school.

djotrofeo - Oct 19, 2009 - 12:40 PM
Post subject:

I'm having a very difficult time letting my 9 year old boy stay here in Shanghai. To be honest, the international schools are ridiculously expensive, therefore, a local school is my only option. Anyone who has the same experience? Is local school a good idea, for one, he doesn't speak Chinese at all. Please help if you know any loca school with a reasonable price. And can accept foreign kids with ZERO CHINESE. Thank you.

djotrofeo - Oct 19, 2009 - 12:41 PM
Post subject:

Please recommend any good school, or any advice? Should I just let him go back to our homeland, than experience the difficulty in a world where language barrier is always an issue?

bbc74 - Oct 19, 2009 - 01:00 PM
Post subject:

I drive past Jincai High School International Campus every morning and have not been impressed by the look of some of the students... Foreign kids plastered in make up with short skirts and a look of pure misery on their faces. I know I probably sound old fashioned but how the students look reflects on a school and if they can get away with looking like that, I wonder what it says about the school

winpetung - Oct 23, 2009 - 11:35 AM
Post subject:

djotrofeo wrote:

Djotrofeo,

There are many other factors which you have to consider when deciding whether to send your child to a local school. The main pull factors are low costs and that your child will learn to speak, listen and write in Chinese after some time while the push factors are huge class size, lack of school facilities, teaching methodologies, etc.

Shanghai Fudan-Vanke Experimental Private School runs a program for foreigners who are not Chinese and English native-speakers. The current tuition fees for A-Program students is RMB12500/semester and there are 2 semesters per year. A-Program students are allowed to transfer to other programs such as B-Program which is an ESL program (mainly local students) or C-Program which is effectively an English and Chinese as first language program.

I'm uncertain if Dong Zhan has a program someone who does not speak a word of Chinese but I know that their tuition fees is about RMB4500 per semester.

Bearing in mind that your child does not speak Chinese, he will be under quite a lot of pressure during his first year. You'll have to adjust your expectations accordingly and provide the love and support at home. In addition, your child will need a committed tutor to help "bring him up to speed". I'm uncertain if you or your child are prepared for this.

Hope this helps!

Iceberg - Oct 23, 2009 - 12:55 PM
Post subject:

Putting a kid in a chinese school would be torture. I suggest you ask him how he feels about it. If he is positive give it a try if he says no way then dont do it. Go back to your country.

mommyNg - Oct 27, 2009 - 08:32 AM
Post subject:

Anybody has recommendations for a local elementary school with international division near JingAn? Any advice? Thanks!

renaong - Nov 19, 2009 - 11:55 PM
Post subject:

Hi, I may be moving to Shanghai with a 5 yr old and 2 yr old. Any recommendation on schools for both boys ? Self-financing, so a reasonably priced and decent school is appreciated. Oh, my older sons speaks good chinese, so chinese is not an issue for now. Thanks !

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