the_librarian wrote:I wouldn't call self-policing to a higher standard than competitors cutting one's own throat.How about being the leader in the industry?
Ha, ha, ha! And how much more would you pay to know that your iPhone was made by a "leader in the industry"? (That's the metaphorical "you", not you personally. I know some people put their money where their mouths are, but depressingly few. Most talk a great line, but in the end, price and bling do the real talking.)
There's also the matter of speed. Apple could control working conditions more effectively if it manufactured in the US in its own plants. But it would have lost the plot a long time ago if it made that decision. One of the advantages of manufacturing in a country with low labour, environmental and safety standards is speed/flexibility. I'm assuming you read the article?
the_librarian wrote:I agree with you that the government is responsible.I'm just saying they're both accountable.The companies can't say that because "they don't know" exactly what's going on they're not responsible.The workers standing up for themselves,I just don't see it happening. They're not empowered and this is not a democracy.
Face it. Apple/HP/Dell/Sony etc. aren't in charge at Foxconn, either. Their influence is limited.
They are hiring a CONTRACTOR to do the manufacturing for them. Never hire a dog and then do the barking for it.
the_librarian wrote:What about you and I, the customers. We know better and what are we doing about it? I say we stop using apple. Wait I better check if my BB is made in China too. Hold on, what about my laptop? The clothes on my back? They're all bound to be made by cheap labour and under poor working conditions.I know I have moral obligation to do something but it's too damn incovenient. Just like the company finds it too inconvenient. This is what I hate about discussing current events, I always end up feeling like a hypocrite.
If I have to think about who should make a change, I have to look at who has the most to gain in this "catch 22" situation.
In the end, if there's no audience, there ain't no show. But I guarantee you that people won't stop buying this stuff simply because somebody died in China. Hell, the Chinese won't stop buying it, either.
There's also the issue of whether Chinese workers really want their global customers saying "we won't buy from China because the conditions don't meet American standards". I personally asked workers in Guangdong at a Chinese factory, through my own (not the company's) interpreter, what they thought about their jobs. They said it was the best job they've ever had, with the best pay and working conditions. The response I got wasn't much different from "please don't kill our golden goose - we prefer this to no jobs at all".
I'm one of the first to flag bad working conditions in Chinese factories, and to try to talk the managers into doing something about it. I tried to sell the owners of one company on letting me redesign their production line because I could see it was dangerous and inefficient. I told them they could get by with only 2/3rds of the workers, produce faster, for less money and with fewer quality problems. It fell on deaf ears even though I spent 30 minutes walking through the plant and describing what I would change, where, to eliminate double handling, redundant steps, redundant labour and safety hazards. It's a very hard sell in China. Many of the managers and even the owners just don't get it. I can see why Apple/HP etc. would have difficulty changing anything. They'd get answers like "OK, we'll fix this", then nothing would be done. There are a million ways to say "NO" in China, and most of them sound like "yes" to western ears.
Check out this article in today's ZD NET.
Apple's supply chain flap: It's really about us
By Larry Dignan | January 27, 2012, 3:04am PST
Summary: Apple is under fire for its supply chain labor, but every tech item—and thing you own—goes through the same manufacturing paces.
Apple CEO Tim Cook has responded to a New York Times report about the working conditions at its Foxconn contract manufacturer as false and offensive.
In a long letter to employees published by 9to5Mac, Cook outlined how Apple cares about workers in its supply chain and takes steps to audit how they are treated. The response comes after a New York Times went into detail about how Apple’s China manufacturing efforts are a) necessary due to U.S. inability to be nimble and b) the cost advantages of making your electronics abroad.
Credit: Associated Press
Apple was the main target of the story, but the Times made a passing mention that there was a tech industry problem. It didn’t go much deeper on the subject. Apple is a much better storyline. I’ve been relatively silent on this Apple supply chain argument because I think the company is being targeted because it’s the big dog on the tech block. In fact, the Apple-Foxconn tale isn’t really just a tech problem. It’s a U.S. problem and it’s a consumer problem that goes well beyond tech.
In other words, Cook has every right to be miffed about the Times report. His company is being singled out.
A few thoughts at a high level:
Apple may be the poster child for manufacturing abroad, but HP also uses Foxconn heavily. Analysts estimate that Apple will be roughly 40 percent of Foxconn’s revenue in 2012. HP is about 25 percent, according to Fubon Research. No one is writing about HP though even though its supply chain report reads just like Apple’s. Every electronic you have on you right now goes through China. The data center that powers the cloud behind those devices were also made by folks stacked in tech dorms in China. The minerals in the battery were mined somewhere. Deep down do you really give a rat’s ass about the working conditions that created those relatively inexpensive devices? Of course not, you’re from a Western economy. And from what I can tell you’re still buying as much tech gear as you can.
This chart from Fubon Research gives you a rough sketch of Hon Hai’s revenue breakdown. Hon Hai is the parent of Foxconn.
See remainder at link.
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/btl/apples-su ... ag=nl.e539Interesting that Apple is being singled out even though many other tech companies have their stuff manufactured by Foxconn. Typical "tall poppy syndrome". And when you look deeper, you're right. It's not just tech products. It's damned near everything. Clothing, cosmetics, appliances, car parts, even food products. Ask Whole Foods, which got into a messy court case last year after it was sued in Florida for misrepresentation of food products that were grown in China using prison labour on polluted land. This story is about a hell of a lot more than Apple, and those pointing at Apple are hypocrites if they aren't acting in accordance with their stated standards.
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