Within 2 weeks i will be visiting Shanghai. I heared here(in The Netherlands) that the suits you will get in Shanghai at the markets won't last for 2 or 3 months. Does anyone have a good stall at the markets with a good price/quality proportion?

vincentclaessen wrote:Within 2 weeks i will be visiting Shanghai. I heared here(in The Netherlands) that the suits you will get in Shanghai at the markets won't last for 2 or 3 months. Does anyone have a good stall at the markets with a good price/quality proportion?

You need to define what you mean by a good stall at the markets. There are several markets and each stall in a market sub-contracts your order to a tailor who has open time. Although some stalls have preferred tailors, if that tailor can not produce your garment on time, the stall owner just goes to one of the other thousands of available tailors. Your chances of having a garment made by the same tailor when you order in a stall twice in a row are pretty slim.

The problem with the fabric markets in Shanghai are usually not the fault of the tailor, but the fault of the customers that do not specify exactly what they want and then are disapointed when they do not get what they thought they ordered. It never ceases to amaze me how a customer expects the tailor to be a mind reader and when they guess wrong, the customer always finds fault with the tailor. The finest suits in the world now come from China so if the rumor in the Netherlands is that a suit ordered in the markets in Shanghai won't last for 2-3 months, I would expect that a high end suit produced in the Netherlands would not last 2-3 weeks.

It is funny to see people that want something custom made to their specifications and then expect someone to guess on what liner to use, waist band, depth of pocket, number and placement of belt loops and size of buttons for braces, style of cut, and how tight or loose the garment should fit etc. If you can't specify exactly what you want, then buy off the rack. If you can specify what you want, it can be made in China for far less money than in other countries.

It's absurd that if I don't specify the number of belt loops that they'll put an insufficient amount and make pockets so shallow a wallet won't fit. How is that the fault of the customer and not the tailor? Oh you didn't want me to give you a piece of crap? Why didn't you say so! Their business is built around suckers who don't know they're about to get substandard rags and who have to leave on a plane the next day.

It's not unreasonable to expect half decent craftsmanship when you buy something in other countries, why is it here?

I've always just bought higher end off the rack suits but this week I went and ordered a couple of suits as per a recommendation on here. First fitting is on Saturday and I'm expecting the worst even after trying to nail down every detail I could think of.

^ There is a saying that goes "one man's trash is another man's treasure". The tailors in China are making garments for individuals from all over the world and each person believes that their standard is the standard that the tailor should use for everyone else. Unfortnately, it is very rare for the tailor in China to ever even see the customer as customers often purchase their custom garments through stalls in fabric markets and the salesperson tries to understand what the customer wants. The sales person then communicates both orally and through written instructions to the tailor to make the garment. Anytime communications pass from one person to another, there is probability of mis-communication, especially when there is a language issue as well.

I have all my garments made in China and am very pleased with the results but I did learn the hard way by not specifyiong exactly what I wanted the first few times I had garments made and for those I was not happy with the outcome. It was clearly my fault for not being specific enough in what I wanted.

Many people today want to live in a risk free environment where they expect all others to do as they please and are quick to find faults in others when the results are not as expected. Such people certainly should not be living in China.

Half decent craftsmanship is something I expect in all countries, including China and I have no problems getting better value in China than anywhere else and the day that changes, I will go elsewhee to purchase.

With a good tailor i meant that when i bring some pictures and i let a tailor take my sizes then it will be made as i want it.
With good quality i meant the fabrics, so that te suit easily can last a year.
And my question is that when i bring some photo's that i can get a good suit. I don't want go back and go back etc. I want it good to be done.

^Sounds like you may be in for trouble right from the start of this project. You say "take my sizes then it will be made as I want it" The stall merchant takes one look at you and if your are American or European he instantly thinks in his mind compared to a Chinese man that you will be putting on weight during the time you will own the suit so he will normally automatically give you a "loose fit" unless you specify how tight you want the suit. Only you know how much weight you may gain or lose over a period of time so letting the merchant guess, will probably give you a fit you are not happy with and blaming the merchant or tailor for that does not make sense.

As far as the fabric lasting a year, I have never seen fabric last less than several years, but then again since no body but you knows your lifestyle and where you will wear, use or abuse your suit it is difficult to predict how long the fabric will last. My guess is that you will find that the fabric will last as long as any fabric of the same quality you purchase in another country. Certain fabrics wear much better than others so you way want to educate yourself on fabrics and blends to make sure you order a suit in the fabric that will meet your requirement.

The garments I have made are normally not perfect on the first try unless I give an exact sample of what I want but usually only minor adjustments need to be made. I don't think you can expect a suit with a perfect fit on the first try anywhere in the world. Sometimes that does happen but it is more a question of luck than workmanship.

Alternatively, don''t go to to the fabric markets, but directly to a tailor shop. Yes, they are (much) more expensive than getting one made via the fabric markets, but still less than a custom made suit in Holland.
Also do have a fitting session half way. You will really need it to make sure everything fits OK and you can still indicate changes then.

I went to the fabric market at museum of sci and tech today. After shopping around for a while I finally stopped at Johns Tailor, K-2 36 I believe. Very professional service, everybody speaks good english, good variety, ect ect.
So, got cashmere suit, and one high quality cotton shirt. First they quoted me like 800 for both, got it down to 560. Should be ready on Monday. If I don't forget, I will write up a review.

Renovator wrote:^Sounds like you may be in for trouble right from the start of this project. You say "take my sizes then it will be made as I want it" The stall merchant takes one look at you and if your are American or European he instantly thinks in his mind compared to a Chinese man that you will be putting on weight during the time you will own the suit so he will normally automatically give you a "loose fit" unless you specify how tight you want the suit.

The garments I have made are normally not perfect on the first try unless I give an exact sample of what I want but usually only minor adjustments need to be made. I don't think you can expect a suit with a perfect fit on the first try anywhere in the world. Sometimes that does happen but it is more a question of luck than workmanship.

And that's my problem... I'm just a week in Shanghai and i need a tailor who can make it a perfect fit within a week. So that i can go back after a 3 days and that he then adjusts the suit where it needs to be adjusted... Anyone an advice or a tailor who can fix this for me?

^The only way I see this happening properly is for you to totally bypass the stalls and go directly to a tailor that has open time and is in Shanghai. You either need to speak Chinese or bring someone along that speaks Chinese as the tailors in the garment district do not speak anything but Chinese and Chinese dialects. You can take the metro to the NanPu bridge stop and then find 399 LuJiabang Lu which is the South Bund Spinning market 1 block or so from the subway or ask a cab to take you there from your hotel.

Once you see the market on the corner, start walking down the streets behind the market that will have several hundred stalls of fabric and many tailors as well. Find a tailor first that has open time that you can work with and then have him measure you and tell you how much fabric you will need. Also ask him for a recommendation on where to buy the fabric as different stalls specialize in different fabrics.

Go to the fabric stalls, buy the fabric and bring it to the tailor. The advantage of doing it this way is that you will save time, be able to work a schedule out with the tailor that meets his and your needs and you will save yourself the stall markup.

What ever you do, don't trust a stall owner to promise you a suit in 1 week. It may happen but will most probably not fit right. Also don't trust a tailor that is willing to come to your hotel as he will deliver the day you leave knowing full well you won't have time to ask for alterations.

Hope this helps. It is a little more leg work for you to go this route but you should be able to get what you want delivered on time and even at a lower price than going to a stall.

Okay Renovator,

So if i get it, it is possible to get a good suit within a week?
However i'm not sure i can arange a chinese speaking person...
How is it with shirts? I have one tailored shirt... When i bring this to a tailor can it be copy'd within a week?
Thanks in advantage

^yes, tailored shirt can be copied within a week but make sure you clearly specify any changes you want from the sample you supply.

You will need a Chinese speaking person just so they can't use the excuse that they did not understand what you said. In order to save face, the Chinese often just say yes to everything you say because it is a sign of weakness to say they don't understand when they really did not understand more than one or two words of what you said. So, yes, it is possible to get both a good suit and a good shirt within a week but given your tight time constraint you really need to be proactive and have the Chinese speaker with you.

Yes okay! Now thanks for the info.
I just have one question left. I have one shirt and i want it copy'd ten times.
Should i do this at once or do i first let them copy one and if its good then copy it nine times?
And do they copy the buttons,labels etc as well?? Do you know a place where they do good copying?

^ If you are in Shanghai for 1 week you need them all made at same time as they will take one week to make your order. No, they do not copy the buttons or labels. If you want really, really nice buttons. I suggest that you supply the buttons for them to put on as the quality of the buttons on shirts are usually just OK. They are not wonderful. Everything else should be fine except if you are picky I would supply the collar stays as well as they tend to be too thin and flexible for my taste.