tihZ_hO wrote:

caisbitter wrote:

caisghost wrote:
Then (a) why do Asian-Americans become just as fat as white Americans after a couple of generations in the U.S., despite the fact that (b) they still care about appearance more?

.....Hey!!

Now I know you're comparing women, but still.....

Sorry mate...it is what it is. America the Beautiful became America the Wide XXXXXL

obesityinamericamap.jpg

meanwhile-in-america.jpg

fat-america.jpg

TAK!

I sometimes put my left leg out of the car window too. no shame in my game. Keeps it fresh.

AnnieTC wrote:Haha... yeah I think it's funny, those studio pix overuse the PS

Using Photoshop to change the faces and bodies of the subjects is over-using Photoshop. The whole idea is ridiculous. It shows how much the subjects have bought into the superficial.

AnnieTC wrote:

caisghost wrote:

AnnieTC wrote:can anyone comment on Luke and Kelly? What's the general opinion regarding them on appearance matching aspect? Suppose if they're not famous, and she's posting her pix online, what kind of comments will she get?

I think that she's super-cute by non-celebrity standards. They'd be evenly matched if they were normal people.

If she was just the girl next door, she'd probably get nice comments. I think she's just a victim of celebrity.

You means she did get bad comments just because she's famous?

Yes. I think it may also be the age of her demographic.

My friends look like her, and when they post pics, the responses are almost always positive. Sometimes they'll say something like, "K., I loved your bangs! Why'd you cut them off?" But that's generally as negative as it gets for real people who've graduated from high school.

I can't overlook looks. But the good news is my standards aren't high. Just need to look healthy and actually have good teeth. Okay never mind, I guess I'm shallow because its hard to find a girl with a good set of teeth. Seriously!

For Chinese girls I usually ask her to show her teeth. I can't stand girls with completely messed up teeth. Some of them their teeth so messed up, every time she smiles she's giving me the middle tooth! I guess its a talent for being able to give two middle fingers and a middle tooth to people she hates!

Anyways these girls are like in their 20s, which really should have good teeth at this age. In their 30s the teeth should still be quite good. 40s is forgiven since this is the age where people start to rot.

Moroes wrote:I can't overlook looks. But the good news is my standards aren't high. Just need to look healthy and actually have good teeth. Okay never mind, I guess I'm shallow because its hard to find a girl with a good set of teeth. Seriously!

For Chinese girls I usually ask her to show her teeth. I can't stand girls with completely messed up teeth. Some of them their teeth so messed up, every time she smiles she's giving me the middle tooth! I guess its a talent for being able to give two middle fingers and a middle tooth to people she hates!

Anyways these girls are like in their 20s, which really should have good teeth at this age. In their 30s the teeth should still be quite good. 40s is forgiven since this is the age where people start to rot.

Understandable... everyone has a preference, most of guys that I found aesthetically attractive happen to be gay...anyways, it's just hard for people to completely overlook the appearance.What makes people charming is that they give everybody a chance, even though they know they're more attracted to some.

Who would marry someone only because of look? It is same for men or women. Look is temporary, changes in years, sometimes in a good way but mostly in a bad way. It can happen even in a second. You can have an accident or some kind of disease. Would it finish the relationship you have or your marriage?

I may be wrong but I believe in Asian countries like China or Japan society can be very cruel against women about appearance. I heard lots of stories that a woman which we could call her a medium or slightly large size in Europe or States, has to deal lots of social pressure not only finding boyfriends also finding jobs in China or Japan.
Unfortunately this pressure is not existing for men in the society. And it's pretty visible.

I think the couples in both pictures are not super attractive people. But world is not full of models or Hollywood stars.

AnnieTC wrote:So, being a Westerner, woman or men wise, as long as you're Caucasian, you do enjoy a little more attention , popularity, appreciation and admiration than you are in your home country then? Due to Chinese people's "bad" taste? Now I do see some difference, people rated ugly in China aren't that bad in the West, people rated handsome in China aren't that good in the West.

I like blue eyes and gray eyes, but that's because it's my fav color... eyes alone doesn't count, it has to go with the face, then face has to go with the body, and body the dressing and the air the person carries.

definately. more than a little more attention. girls never asked me on a date back home, and never would! they certainly wouldnt invite themselfs to my apartment. i'd have to fight to get anywhere with a girl back home!

i think any average/below average westerners here will have an easy time. unless they are super fat or ugly. but certain things have the most desirability.

-tallness
-blue eyes
- blonde hair
-curly hair

if you got all those you hit the jackpot basicly.

ultimatekrang wrote:

AnnieTC wrote:So, being a Westerner, woman or men wise, as long as you're Caucasian, you do enjoy a little more attention , popularity, appreciation and admiration than you are in your home country then? Due to Chinese people's "bad" taste? Now I do see some difference, people rated ugly in China aren't that bad in the West, people rated handsome in China aren't that good in the West.

I like blue eyes and gray eyes, but that's because it's my fav color... eyes alone doesn't count, it has to go with the face, then face has to go with the body, and body the dressing and the air the person carries.

definately. more than a little more attention. girls never asked me on a date back home, and never would! they certainly wouldnt invite themselfs to my apartment. i'd have to fight to get anywhere with a girl back home!

i think any average/below average westerners here will have an easy time. unless they are super fat or ugly. but certain things have the most desirability.

-tallness
-blue eyes
- blonde hair
-curly hair

if you got all those you hit the jackpot basicly.

You forgot the most attractive feature of all: fat wallet

aterina wrote:Unfortunately this pressure is not existing for men in the society. And it's pretty visible.

True! My Western girlfriends all complain that guys here get more attention and they get to view and choose way more pretty girls, but there aren't that many Asian men that looks attractive and exciting. It's unfair, they say.

jquincy wrote:

ultimatekrang wrote:
definately. more than a little more attention. girls never asked me on a date back home, and never would! they certainly wouldnt invite themselfs to my apartment. i'd have to fight to get anywhere with a girl back home!

i think any average/below average westerners here will have an easy time. unless they are super fat or ugly. but certain things have the most desirability.

-tallness
-blue eyes
- blonde hair
-curly hair

if you got all those you hit the jackpot basicly.

You forgot the most attractive feature of all: fat wallet

fat wallet also works in the West doesn't it ? It can even get you supermodels.

I think Western guys appeal more to girls, not just because of their genetic features, but also the fact that they symbolize a more prosperous and carefree life, they're regarded generally more caring, more romantic and respectful towards women. Of course among them there are playboys, heartbreakers and wifebeaters... but it is not the general impression. I think it's time for Chinese guys here to forget about their bitter Napoleon complex and sarcastic comments on girls choosing Western guys over them as sluts, they should go to gym and workshops to improve their own image.

its better to be confident whoever u are but they arnt exactly missing out on much with some of these girls..

if i wanted to be serious with a girl i would not stick with a girl who is a superficial whitey chaser. its almost as bad as a money grabber. i think that they think the west is all one big country where everyone looks the same and everyone is a 'handsome gentleman'

ultimatekrang wrote:
if i wanted to be serious with a girl i would not stick with a girl who is a superficial whitey chaser. its almost as bad as a money grabber. i think that they think the west is all one big country where everyone looks the same and everyone is a 'handsome gentleman'

It is actually a kind of fact. If you compare with Asian men, Western men takes better care of themselves because it is competitive out there.
You see the same mistake of men also in Middle East or Turkey. They don't take care of their appearance or shape as much as ladies do.And funny fact you would be surprised how much those guys expect from the ladies.
I have a Japanese friend who just gave up herself since a while and one day we were drinking, I asked her why she gave up so much so sudden, she answered with wet eyes her Japanese husband (oww you should see him, he has a very very bad taste on clothing and a unlucky genetic heritage face) doesn't find her attractive anymore because she gained some pounds and told her exactly the same same sentence!! Since then she gave up more because of the deep deppression that bustard caused. I really can not imagine my husband told me that !!

AnnieTC wrote:I think it's time for Chinese guys here to forget about their bitter Napoleon complex and sarcastic comments on girls choosing Western guys over them as sluts, they should go to gym and workshops to improve their own image.

They really shouldn't care. If their assesment of those girls is true (not saying it is), then aren't the "bad" ones being weeded out?

Why suffer a coronary being upset about it?

That said when Napoleon Dynamite looks like George Clooney to a large percentage of Chinese women it can be an annoying disadvantage for the less secure.

Moroes wrote:I can't overlook looks. But the good news is my standards aren't high. Just need to look healthy and actually have good teeth. Okay never mind, I guess I'm shallow because its hard to find a girl with a good set of teeth. Seriously!

For Chinese girls I usually ask her to show her teeth. I can't stand girls with completely messed up teeth. Some of them their teeth so messed up, every time she smiles she's giving me the middle tooth! I guess its a talent for being able to give two middle fingers and a middle tooth to people she hates!

Anyways these girls are like in their 20s, which really should have good teeth at this age. In their 30s the teeth should still be quite good. 40s is forgiven since this is the age where people start to rot.

LOL!! China is much like West Virginia, the toothbrush was invented in Bluefield or perhaps Wuhan. But yes, nice teeth and nicely manicured toes are a requisite for me.

anter wrote:

rickettyrabbit wrote:Neither one is particularly attractive to me, but there's more to love than just a pretty face.

If you've been around the block a few times you know of women (if you're a guy) or guys (if you're a woman) who didn't look very good when you first met them, but seemed to get better over time. Likewise, I'm sure you've met very attractive people who ended up looking unattractive after you found that they were "ugly on the inside".

Perception of attractiveness is subjective. Think of that "once in a lifetime" great meal you remember from a fantastic vacation. The truth is that your perception is influenced by the context and your mood. Restaurant pros call it the "vacation effect". It's very real.

Some not-so-attractive women can look strikingly beautiful at the "happy-ending" moment. This is a look you'll never see if you haven't been intimate and in love with them. But once you see that look of bliss, she'll look much better to you every moment of every day.

I pretty much agree with RR, as usual.

As people move through the decades of life, if they get a chance to go around the dating experience in each decade it is hard, after 45, to find anyone attractive physically in the first instance. It's more like looking at the other person and thinking well they are not unattractive. Then the person "grows" on you because given time you see the beautiful aspects of them, not just the surface, also how well you fit together as people. The surface becomes less important while the inner person and your relationship with that is paramount.

This happens between long term married people as well but at least they most likely fell in love in the first instance when they found each other attractive.
Sometimes I see long term marrieds where one of the two has aged much better or stayed attractive while the other has not but they still appear to be in love.

I agree with both of you, and some intelligence is necessary too.

aterina wrote:Who would marry someone only because of look? It is same for men or women. Look is temporary, changes in years, sometimes in a good way but mostly in a bad way. It can happen even in a second. You can have an accident or some kind of disease. Would it finish the relationship you have or your marriage?

I may be wrong but I believe in Asian countries like China or Japan society can be very cruel against women about appearance. I heard lots of stories that a woman which we could call her a medium or slightly large size in Europe or States, has to deal lots of social pressure not only finding boyfriends also finding jobs in China or Japan.
Unfortunately this pressure is not existing for men in the society. And it's pretty visible.

I think the couples in both pictures are not super attractive people. But world is not full of models or Hollywood stars.

It really has nothing to do with it. Western standards are the same, but no matter how hard they try, only 5-10% can lose weight and keep it off. (And a shocking percentage of them actually meet the criteria for EDs.) We know its environmental, but we're not quite sure what's going on. A lot of scientists think it has to do with a class of chemicals, called endocrine disruptors, that our parents and grandparents were exposed to.

AnneTC wrote:fat wallet also works in the West doesn't it ? It can even get you supermodels.

Not quite like it does in China -- compatibility still counts. I dated a guy worth millions, but I broke up with him because he abused his pets. The majority of Western women have very set standards of what they want and don't want, and they're far less likely to bend their rules just because a man's rich. Plus the women who do marry a man because he's rich are usually viewed as gold-diggers or prostitutes, so they're not respected. In China, it's so normal to use marriage to advance economically that it is.

I think the other issue is that Chinese women think they can "let the man pretend he's in control, but really hold all the power" (i.e., manipulate men into doing what they want him to do). Western women tend to believe that people are the way they are. Plus, we think that if you're busy manipulating someone, there's something fundamentally very, very wrong in your relationship -- and probably your personality.

I think Western guys appeal more to girls, not just because of their genetic features, but also the fact that they symbolize a more prosperous and carefree life, they're regarded generally more caring, more romantic and respectful towards women. Of course among them there are playboys, heartbreakers and wifebeaters... but it is not the general impression

Research strongly suggests that there's far less domestic violence in the West, and particularly Northern EU, than in China. Cheating also appears to be less common because (a) you're much more likely to lose a lot more money in a divorce if you cheat, (b) it's not encouraged, and (c) you'll usually lose face if it gets out. (Just look at the nightmares it's causing the Gingrich campaign.)

Where do you think the caring and respectful ideas come from? Direct communication/PDAs and the fact that Western men do more housework than Chinese men do?

AnnieTC unless you think Ms Osborne is Chinese, you seem to be asking two questions here, one being how is it possible for two seemingly mismatched people looks-wise to get together, and secondly, do we Westerners think all Chinese look the same?
I'm not even going to start with this one other than to say I think far too much emphasis is placed on looks in China and people need to cultivate a bit more depth in their relationships with each other. And I have it on excellent authority that Chinese people think all we Westerners look the same - certainly when I go to the same teller at the same bank month after month I can remember his face but he's flat out remembering me, makes me laugh every time

aterina wrote:It is actually a kind of fact. If you compare with Asian men, Western men takes better care of themselves because it is competitive out there.

no not all of them. theres plenty of guys that dont care about that. the difference is that those guys in the west dont get girls falling into their lap. they dont get any, or they get the worst and fattest type.
chinese guys can sit in a net bar all day, wear the same crappy clothes for weeks on end. have no style or charm and still end up with a pretty hot wife and then cheat on them later.

they got the women well under control.

caisghost wrote:

aterina wrote:
Where do you think the caring and respectful ideas come from? Direct communication/PDAs and the fact that Western men do more housework than Chinese men do?

From movies and TV series, and direct contact, their view on sex etc. And yes the housework is definitely another issue. I think if the society is more fair to women, given equal chances on rights and opportunities, women would focus more on finding whom they really love, instead of finding someone who could provide the financial stability ( safety and security is low on Maslow's . I personally think there is a lot of psychological problems here, a lot of relationships indicate the persons involved might have borderline personality syndrome, it's just people are not aware of that.

pinkpoodle72 wrote:AnnieTC unless you think Ms Osborne is Chinese, you seem to be asking two questions here, one being how is it possible for two seemingly mismatched people looks-wise to get together, and secondly, do we Westerners think all Chinese look the same?
I'm not even going to start with this one other than to say I think far too much emphasis is placed on looks in China and people need to cultivate a bit more depth in their relationships with each other. And I have it on excellent authority that Chinese people think all we Westerners look the same - certainly when I go to the same teller at the same bank month after month I can remember his face but he's flat out remembering me, makes me laugh every time

Yeah... sorry I got a bit mixed up. I originally just want to know how people from different cultures judge a couple's appearance and whether they "match".My mentioning the friend's quote on Westerners don't recognize Asians is just to hint "that's why they can't tell beauty from ugliness".

But I agree that Chinese society has a double standard on looks, women are a bit pushed by the men, unfortunately.

anter wrote:We are not cartons of milk with a use by date Annie.

The only sour turn here is in the minds of the women who buy into such dumb cliches.

I love this!

AnnieTC wrote:

caisghost wrote:

aterina wrote:
Where do you think the caring and respectful ideas come from? Direct communication/PDAs and the fact that Western men do more housework than Chinese men do?

From movies and TV series, and direct contact, their view on sex etc. And yes the housework is definitely another issue. I think if the society is more fair to women, given equal chances on rights and opportunities, women would focus more on finding whom they really love, instead of finding someone who could provide the financial stability ( safety and security is low on Maslow's . I personally think there is a lot of psychological problems here, a lot of relationships indicate the persons involved might have borderline personality syndrome, it's just people are not aware of that.

Fair enough.

But banish thy psych classes! Real STEMers know it's nothing but pseudo-science for a reason. Axis II is the absolute worst.

AnnieTC wrote:I think if the society is more fair to women, given equal chances on rights and opportunities, women would focus more on finding whom they really love, instead of finding someone who could provide the financial stability ( safety and security is low on Maslow's .

I don't disagree with your basic point, but while Maslow's hierarchy is a good way to explain motivation, it is not useful for predicting behaviour. The whole idea that people progress through "levels" of needs, moving up the pyramid only when they're satisfied at each level, has not been borne out by research. In fact, people seem to pursue needs on several different levels simultaneously, and will over-dose on the needs in one level of they're unable to satisfy one of the other levels. For example, asking for more money because the work is tiresome and boring; or eating too much KFC or pasta (or too many hotdogs) because they can't find a boyfriend.

Oh, did I say that?? Shame on me!

caisghost wrote:Yes. I think it may also be the age of her demographic.

My friends look like her, and when they post pics, the responses are almost always positive. Sometimes they'll say something like, "K., I loved your bangs! Why'd you cut them off?" But that's generally as negative as it gets for real people who've graduated from high school.

For me Kelly Osbourne (and by analogy your friend) is plain ugly. Of course I wouldn’t tell her in face because that would hurt her feelings.

I would personally not consider dating her even if she was the last woman on earth. But hey, tastes are relative and even the ugly chicks can get lucky and find a cute boyfriend with low standards.

The problem is that, in general, the ugly girls, they know they are ugly and they tend to be insecure and jealous. I think it’s a nightmare for the cute guy to be with a girl well below his league…

wolfyx wrote:
. . . Kelly Osbourne . . .
I would personally not consider dating her even if she was the last woman on earth.

I think you underestimate the perception-distorting power of seminal retention.