HOW TO TRANSFER MY MONEY FROM CHINA TO U.S.

Ask about visas and legal issues

HOW TO TRANSFER MY MONEY FROM CHINA TO U.S.

Postby condesa » Tue Aug 04, 2009 3:41 pm

Hi,
I'm about to move to China for a new job. I will be getting paid in RMB with direct deposit to my bank of choice.
Question: I still will need to keep paying stuff in US. How do I transfer money from my bank account in China (in RMB I guess) to my bank account in US (in U$) so I can keep making my payments online as I have been doing until now?.

what is the smart way to do it, any suggestions?, any bank recommendations to make my life easier and pay lower fees.

In terms of amount of money I'm thinking around 7-14k RMB/ month, I read in other post that I have money restrictions as well?, in terms of much I can send out?.

I'm going with a work visa, employment contract and all the nice stuff, etc,etc.

Thanks for the help,
User avatar
condesa
Fire-eater
Fire-eater
 
Posts: 2600
Mood: Happy
Joined: Sun Aug 02, 2009 4:17 pm
Location: Almost in Los Angeles

Postby MrPuxi » Tue Aug 04, 2009 3:51 pm

no restrictions and limitations practically, only a bit of a hassle. as long as your money is legit and you have papers to prove it (employment contract, visa, tax rexeipts...) you can T/T all you want. there may be a restrictions by means of daily limit, but i think, no offense, you are not quite there.
MrPuxi
Rocker
Rocker
 
Posts: 677
Joined: Wed Jan 30, 2008 6:03 pm

Postby SH_steveABC » Tue Aug 04, 2009 3:58 pm

The process is involved and needs a lot of paperwork, get used to that if you're moving and working here.

I am in an identical situation and my job deposits in Bank of China (BOC). Every couple of months I have to go in fill in a form (bilingual), provide my passport, work permit (your employer will have it) and a contract verfying your employment and monthly income. Most importantly you need an official document with company chop outlining the taxes you have paid. You are not allowed to transfer income earned in China in RMB that you have not paid taxes on. So essentially any tax-free portion of your income cannot be moved out of the country. This is the official way of doing it.

Bank of China does not allow internet international wire transfers, perhaps there are other banks that do. It would allow you to save time and hassle dealing with the less than patient and less than English-fluent bank tellers.

An easier way to do it (something I am looking into now) is to make an arrangement with a friend or colleague who gets paid in USD and has a US bank account but works here or otherwise needs RMB. What you could do is have an informal agreement with him/her to regularly intra-China wire them RMB to their Chinese account. In exchange they wire money from their US bank account into your US bank account. This avoids the problem of only being able to bring out taxed income and the transfer and exchange fees the bank charges.

Lastly you could always exchange the money here and physically take it into the US with someone you trust. I have colleagues who do this.
SH_steveABC
Seeker
Seeker
 
Posts: 58
Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2009 2:45 pm

Postby SH_steveABC » Tue Aug 04, 2009 4:01 pm

MrPuxi wrote:no restrictions and limitations practically, only a bit of a hassle. as long as your money is legit and you have papers to prove it (employment contract, visa, tax rexeipts...) you can T/T all you want. there may be a restrictions by means of daily limit, but i think, no offense, you are not quite there.


My understanding from going into BOC and trying to transfer more is that you are limited to the amount of income you have paid Chinese income tax. For some there is a tax-exempt portion of income (usually food and rent, reimbursing fapiaos). I have tried to transfer 100% of my after tax wages and was limited to only what I could document I had been taxed on. Can someone else vouch for this or have I been cheated by BOC?
SH_steveABC
Seeker
Seeker
 
Posts: 58
Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2009 2:45 pm

Postby chingiskhan » Tue Aug 04, 2009 4:11 pm

SH_steveABC wrote:
MrPuxi wrote:no restrictions and limitations practically, only a bit of a hassle. as long as your money is legit and you have papers to prove it (employment contract, visa, tax rexeipts...) you can T/T all you want. there may be a restrictions by means of daily limit, but i think, no offense, you are not quite there.


My understanding from going into BOC and trying to transfer more is that you are limited to the amount of income you have paid Chinese income tax. For some there is a tax-exempt portion of income (usually food and rent, reimbursing fapiaos). I have tried to transfer 100% of my after tax wages and was limited to only what I could document I had been taxed on. Can someone else vouch for this or have I been cheated by BOC?


I think it's unusual for anyone to transfer 100% of their salary. Do you not eat while you are here? My understanding is that you can exchange the taxable part and that makes perfect sense. The allowance part is for you to cover living expenses in China so it would be odd to ask for that to be transferred out of the country as well. Nice problem to have though as it means you aren't spending much.
chingiskhan
Shanghai Royalty
Shanghai Royalty
 
Posts: 9839
Joined: Tue Apr 24, 2007 3:53 pm

Oh, boy !!!!!!

Postby condesa » Tue Aug 04, 2009 4:29 pm

Thank you gentlemen for the very useful responses.

I guess this is going to be a nice cultural shock, like the movie Brazil.......

Yes, Mr.Puxi, I'm clearly not quite there but thanks again for enlighten me.
User avatar
condesa
Fire-eater
Fire-eater
 
Posts: 2600
Mood: Happy
Joined: Sun Aug 02, 2009 4:17 pm
Location: Almost in Los Angeles

ICBC Bank - has international wire transfers.

Postby condesa » Tue Aug 04, 2009 5:02 pm

Perhaps it is worthwhile for you to check into this Bank, you may be able to send money back home on line just doing the bureaucratic process only one to get the USB or whatever name the authorization is called (very original name, da !!!).

http://www.icbc.com.cn/icbc/personal%20 ... emittance/

I will check other Banks and post if I see anything promising.
User avatar
condesa
Fire-eater
Fire-eater
 
Posts: 2600
Mood: Happy
Joined: Sun Aug 02, 2009 4:17 pm
Location: Almost in Los Angeles

Postby SH_steveABC » Tue Aug 04, 2009 5:51 pm

chingiskhan wrote:
SH_steveABC wrote:
MrPuxi wrote:no restrictions and limitations practically, only a bit of a hassle. as long as your money is legit and you have papers to prove it (employment contract, visa, tax rexeipts...) you can T/T all you want. there may be a restrictions by means of daily limit, but i think, no offense, you are not quite there.


My understanding from going into BOC and trying to transfer more is that you are limited to the amount of income you have paid Chinese income tax. For some there is a tax-exempt portion of income (usually food and rent, reimbursing fapiaos). I have tried to transfer 100% of my after tax wages and was limited to only what I could document I had been taxed on. Can someone else vouch for this or have I been cheated by BOC?


I think it's unusual for anyone to transfer 100% of their salary. Do you not eat while you are here? My understanding is that you can exchange the taxable part and that makes perfect sense. The allowance part is for you to cover living expenses in China so it would be odd to ask for that to be transferred out of the country as well. Nice problem to have though as it means you aren't spending much.



Certainly, I don't spend a lot month to month, so I could send back one month the equivalent of one month's total salary. Was not implying that 100% of every month goes home. Just stick to noodle soups, avoid the Sherpa's and shop at local groceries and wet markets...
SH_steveABC
Seeker
Seeker
 
Posts: 58
Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2009 2:45 pm

Re: ICBC Bank - has international wire transfers.

Postby Cylon » Tue Aug 04, 2009 6:15 pm

condesa wrote:Perhaps it is worthwhile for you to check into this Bank, you may be able to send money back home on line just doing the bureaucratic process only one to get the USB or whatever name the authorization is called (very original name, da !!!).

http://www.icbc.com.cn/icbc/personal%20 ... emittance/

I will check other Banks and post if I see anything promising.


Even with ICBC online transfer you still need to have the USD physically in the account before you can send online. You cannot convert RMB to USD through online banking and you can't sent the RMB out of China directly.
www.sinohosting.net | Web Hosting in China, HK, Singapore and the USA
Social Networking Website for Expats in Shanghai | www.shanghaizoom.com
Cylon
PopStar
PopStar
 
Posts: 1156
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2006 11:22 am

Re: HOW TO TRANSFER MY MONEY FROM CHINA TO U.S.

Postby Cylon » Tue Aug 04, 2009 6:20 pm

condesa wrote:Hi,
I'm about to move to China for a new job. I will be getting paid in RMB with direct deposit to my bank of choice.
Question: I still will need to keep paying stuff in US. How do I transfer money from my bank account in China (in RMB I guess) to my bank account in US (in U$) so I can keep making my payments online as I have been doing until now?.

what is the smart way to do it, any suggestions?, any bank recommendations to make my life easier and pay lower fees.

In terms of amount of money I'm thinking around 7-14k RMB/ month, I read in other post that I have money restrictions as well?, in terms of much I can send out?.

I'm going with a work visa, employment contract and all the nice stuff, etc,etc.

Thanks for the help,


This should not be an issue in your case, since once can exchange USD500 worth of RMB per day. So you will need to make a stop at the bank a couple of days each month. Transferring to the US once you get the USD will not be a problem.
www.sinohosting.net | Web Hosting in China, HK, Singapore and the USA
Social Networking Website for Expats in Shanghai | www.shanghaizoom.com
Cylon
PopStar
PopStar
 
Posts: 1156
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2006 11:22 am

Postby california2shanghai » Tue Aug 04, 2009 6:29 pm

condesa, you should ask your company if they can organize for a certain portion of your salary to be automatically wire transferred to your US bank account every month, it's certainly possible. my company puts half my salary in RMB into a local bank account, but also is able to deposit the other half of my paycvheck in USD in the same US bank account i used when i was back in the US. i do get a charge from my US bank for the wire transfer. i've never had to visit the local bank or fill out any forms every month to do this, it's hassle-free.
california2shanghai
Reacher
Reacher
 
Posts: 202
Joined: Fri Dec 21, 2007 7:23 pm

Postby california2shanghai » Tue Aug 04, 2009 6:31 pm

SH_steve, I did transfer an additional sum of money back to the US at one point, and I needed to prove that I had paid Chinese taxes on it...I don't think BOC is cheating you.
california2shanghai
Reacher
Reacher
 
Posts: 202
Joined: Fri Dec 21, 2007 7:23 pm

Postby chingiskhan » Tue Aug 04, 2009 6:55 pm

Yes you need to convert the money to USD. That is the complicated part. Wiring the money is VERY EASY as long as you have done the conversion. ICBC online works fine again once you have the USD sitting there.
chingiskhan
Shanghai Royalty
Shanghai Royalty
 
Posts: 9839
Joined: Tue Apr 24, 2007 3:53 pm

Postby bigfatboy » Wed Aug 05, 2009 6:43 am

SH_steveABC wrote:The process is involved and needs a lot of paperwork, get used to that if you're moving and working here.


yes very true. when i first came to shanghai, i pretty much lost my cool very single time I go to the bank trying to get something 'simple' done at the counter (including wiring money). something that can be done easily in the states, might be extremely troublesome here. just expect the 'trouble', and give enough butter time. also, picking a 'good' local bank is important, by good i mean more technologically advance, less people, better service (both online and at the counter), and for that i suggest china merchant bank- http://english.cmbchina.com/.
hope it helps.
bigfatboy
Talker
Talker
 
Posts: 100
Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 10:32 pm

Postby condesa » Wed Aug 05, 2009 11:38 am

california2shanghai wrote:condesa, you should ask your company if they can organize for a certain portion of your salary to be automatically wire transferred to your US bank account every month, it's certainly possible. my company puts half my salary in RMB into a local bank account, but also is able to deposit the other half of my paycvheck in USD in the same US bank account i used when i was back in the US. i do get a charge from my US bank for the wire transfer. i've never had to visit the local bank or fill out any forms every month to do this, it's hassle-free.



California,
Yes, I think that could be the ideal solution to my 'monetary predicaments', have my company handle the direct deposits into 2 different bank accounts every month (one in China, one in US). That could save me tons of headaches.
Thanks a lot !!!
User avatar
condesa
Fire-eater
Fire-eater
 
Posts: 2600
Mood: Happy
Joined: Sun Aug 02, 2009 4:17 pm
Location: Almost in Los Angeles

Postby condesa » Wed Aug 05, 2009 11:43 am

bigfatboy wrote:
SH_steveABC wrote:The process is involved and needs a lot of paperwork, get used to that if you're moving and working here.


yes very true. when i first came to shanghai, i pretty much lost my cool very single time I go to the bank trying to get something 'simple' done at the counter (including wiring money). something that can be done easily in the states, might be extremely troublesome here. just expect the 'trouble', and give enough butter time. also, picking a 'good' local bank is important, by good i mean more technologically advance, less people, better service (both online and at the counter), and for that i suggest china merchant bank- http://english.cmbchina.com/.
hope it helps.


Bigfat,
that was going to be my next question, asking for a 'good' local bank. I agree with you, 'good banking' to hardly ever have to walk inside the bank and doing a line is having like 5 people in front of me.
Thank s lot !!!!
User avatar
condesa
Fire-eater
Fire-eater
 
Posts: 2600
Mood: Happy
Joined: Sun Aug 02, 2009 4:17 pm
Location: Almost in Los Angeles

Postby jimbo123 » Thu Aug 06, 2009 12:54 pm

Has anyone tried western union? I send money all the time to U.S. and never have any questions asked about where the money comes from. I go to BOC and change rmb to USD(50,000 limit per year) than go to Western Union to send the USD. :)
jimbo123
Squeeker
Squeeker
 
Posts: 10
Joined: Wed Oct 29, 2008 7:04 am

Postby hammerforlife » Thu Aug 06, 2009 1:20 pm

jimbo123 wrote:Has anyone tried western union? I send money all the time to U.S. and never have any questions asked about where the money comes from. I go to BOC and change rmb to USD(50,000 limit per year) than go to Western Union to send the USD. :)


Why bother going to Western Union? If you have the USD it is easy to transfer money from BOC. It is the exchange part to USD that requires the paperwork, not the transfer.
hammerforlife
StreetBeater
StreetBeater
 
Posts: 2246
Joined: Mon May 24, 2004 4:30 pm

Postby leefc » Thu Aug 06, 2009 1:23 pm

it might be worthwhile checking out banks that have a presence in the US and in Shanghai. i've seen a few citibank ATMs and there's even a Citi tower.
leefc
Lurker
Lurker
 
Posts: 27
Joined: Tue Jun 09, 2009 10:01 pm

Postby pat_togo » Thu Aug 06, 2009 1:36 pm

leefc wrote:it might be worthwhile checking out banks that have a presence in the US and in Shanghai. i've seen a few citibank ATMs and there's even a Citi tower.


This will not solve the exchange part as foreign banks with a presence here in China still have to follow local banking laws. Actually you can get more done with local banks as foreign banks have restrictions.
China, HK & Offshore Incorporation Services
---
Visit us at the Expat Show Shanghai (September 17-19, 2010 - Booth 26)
User avatar
pat_togo
Barker
Barker
 
Posts: 186
Joined: Tue Feb 22, 2005 2:10 am
Location: Shanghai

Postby gelliott » Thu Aug 06, 2009 4:10 pm

Two steps: 1) Change RMB to USD, 2) Transfer USD to US bank.

Step 1)
Option a: Do it legally. Go to your bank with your Passport, Alien Work Permit, monthly pay slips (showing your income and taxes) chopped with the company seal, and govermnent issued tax receipts (with taxed amounts matching your monthly pay slips). Both of these you should be able to get from your company HR. Make sure the months on the pay slip and the tax receipt match, and ideally they will be from the current or previous year (though this can get tricky as taxes are not always immediately collected).
If you are lucky, this will work. I've succeeded 5 times, and been rejected at least as many because of missing some document or other. it seems to differ each time. You may also want to bring your employment contract as they sometimes want this. I've also found out that they cannot change currency on weekends, for some strange reason. So be prepared to go on a weekday.
I heard the yearly limit for transfer is $50k, but have not experienced this myself. They seem to make a note on your tax receipt showing how much you have transferred at each instance, and I guess this is how they monitor you. You can easily throw this out and get a new copy, so the process control seems flawed.

Option b: Do it illegally. Find a "Huang Niu" ("Gold Cow", Black market exchange), which is usually a guy hanging out in front of the bank making eyes at foreigners. I've never done it myself, but I know many who do, and many Chinese will tell you this is a much better way. It is certainly faster, and I've heard they will even give you a better exchange rate.

Step 2)
I've always done wire transfers from my Chinese bank to by US bank. All I need is the US bank details (name, address, routing number) and my account number. If the USD is in your chinese bank, you can fill out the paperwork at the bank and they'll perform the transfer. I use China Merchants Bank as well, and they charge 200RMB for the service. The transfer is very easy, and takes about 4 days to process (so they can kite your funds). I recommend this bank as their customer service is very good, even if they are forced to be overly beaurocratic by the government.


Hope this helps.
gelliott
Newbie
 
Posts: 7
Joined: Tue Jun 20, 2006 10:54 am

Postby sinned69 » Thu Aug 06, 2009 4:23 pm

There is an even easier way, if you have a Chinese national then have them accompany you to the bank, simply have them use their ID card to complete the currency exchange and the TTF of your funds (obviously someone you trust). The process is simple, they simply produce their ID card, to exchange the currency fill out a form for the TTF and hey presto all done.

Now the conversion part is either physically done or as step 1 of the 2 step process (RMB-forex-TTF) then, it just depends. I've seen both ways, physically handing over rmb400,000 from out of my plastic bag (since I withdrew my funds from different banks then had to go to BOC to actually do the TTF), the teller counts all the cash, even it has a security seal in bundles from other banks, then have had actually physical forex in exchange for the RMB, then the same teller simply takes the forex back for the TTF. Other times, they of course take the RMB, but just do a simple calculation, tell me the exhange when agreed, the next stage (my Chinese friend/colleague) completes the TTF form. Chinese are limited to RMB-forex equivalent to US$50,000/yr.

As noted in the posts above there are other ways, both legal/legit and not... I've used the Huang Niu on the odd occasion and I've written about that process in other threads.

There was also someone based in SH that was working through ANZ that can help set up a system and accounts that can handle RMB-forex and TTF to accounts overseas. Was posted in a thread within past two months...

Best search through some previous threads
45-50wpm w 3-5% error rate. i apologise now for my typos. - damn butter fingers :P
User avatar
sinned69
PopStar
PopStar
 
Posts: 1241
Mood: Cool
Joined: Wed Sep 01, 2004 5:15 pm
Location: Shanghai (2002-2004) Zhejiang (2005-current)

Postby tomnoddy_uk » Mon Sep 28, 2009 12:26 pm

I am having trouble filling out a form to transfer money from ICBC to United bank in the US, via the bank of new york (as they have some partnership with them). Has anyone done this, or a similar transfer that could offer advice? With the horror stories I have heard/read about I am a little nervous as need to pay off some student loan fees and don't want my money to get lost.

Is the SWIFT address needed and/or important or is only the SWIFT account number important?

If the SWIFT address is important, where does does it belong on the application forms?

If anyone has successfully transferred money could they help me out on this? I can give you a call if it is any easier?

Thanks,
tomnoddy_uk
StreetBeater
StreetBeater
 
Posts: 2345
Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2006 11:02 am

Postby MoonOverMiami » Mon Sep 28, 2009 12:48 pm

The SWIFT identifies the bank, and then you enter the account number you want the transfer to credit.

Do you see the United bank in the ICBC transfer website? Or do you have to transfer it to the Bank of New York...and then have them credit your United bank account?
Charly: "Were you always this stupid or did you take lessons?"
Mitch: "I took lessons."
User avatar
MoonOverMiami
Fire-eater
Fire-eater
 
Posts: 2571
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2008 9:58 am

Postby Humac » Mon Sep 28, 2009 1:00 pm

If it's the form headed "Application For Funds Transfer (Overseas)" then your swift and iban numbers go in the no. 70 box called "remittance information".
your transfer "via bank of New York" may complicate things though, can't you just give your United bank details?
User avatar
Humac
Post Boaster
 
Posts: 4729
Joined: Sat Jul 07, 2007 9:48 pm

Postby tomnoddy_uk » Mon Sep 28, 2009 2:51 pm

Many thanks both of you.

moonovermiami - icbc has some sort of deal with the bank of new york to do transfers and united also has ties to them. i'm not 100% sure on the reasoning but both banks here and there said the same. we'll be sending the money via forms rather than online.
tomnoddy_uk
StreetBeater
StreetBeater
 
Posts: 2345
Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2006 11:02 am

Postby wimpy » Wed Dec 02, 2009 9:35 am

Has anyone tried to deposit into a foreign based (US Held) account at Citibank in a local branch?

I see Citibank around the city and I would like to deposit US Dollars into an account based in Citibank Florida. Can I simply go in with USD and my ATM card and go to the teller to make the transaction?
wimpy
Squeeker
Squeeker
 
Posts: 14
Joined: Tue Oct 13, 2009 10:26 pm

Postby MoonOverMiami » Wed Dec 02, 2009 10:01 am

No. While you can withdraw money without incurring any fees besides the foreign exchange rates, the banks operate separately.

Not sure if they will let you do it, but you can go up to the counter and ask to transfer the USD to your bank account in Florida considering it is a Citibank. However, if you go in with USD in hand you may be subject to the double conversion (USD to RMB to process the request, and RMB back to USD for the transfer out). Depending on the amount, this could add up to quite a bit.
Charly: "Were you always this stupid or did you take lessons?"
Mitch: "I took lessons."
User avatar
MoonOverMiami
Fire-eater
Fire-eater
 
Posts: 2571
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2008 9:58 am

Postby AndrewH » Fri Dec 04, 2009 4:49 pm

sinned69 wrote:There is an even easier way, if you have a Chinese national then have them accompany you to the bank, simply have them use their ID card to complete the currency exchange and the TTF of your funds (obviously someone you trust). The process is simple, they simply produce their ID card, to exchange the currency fill out a form for the TTF and hey presto all done.

Now the conversion part is either physically done or as step 1 of the 2 step process (RMB-forex-TTF) then, it just depends. I've seen both ways, physically handing over rmb400,000 from out of my plastic bag (since I withdrew my funds from different banks then had to go to BOC to actually do the TTF), the teller counts all the cash, even it has a security seal in bundles from other banks, then have had actually physical forex in exchange for the RMB, then the same teller simply takes the forex back for the TTF. Other times, they of course take the RMB, but just do a simple calculation, tell me the exhange when agreed, the next stage (my Chinese friend/colleague) completes the TTF form. Chinese are limited to RMB-forex equivalent to US$50,000/yr.




I receive GBP into my BOC account and change it to RMB as required. Will the Bank also change the currency back then ? To GBP, or must it be USD?
AndrewH
Newbie
 
Posts: 3
Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2009 8:05 pm

Postby chingy » Tue Mar 02, 2010 1:26 pm

Yesterday I went to ICBC to exchange some RMB into USD and wire it back home. My experience was pretty much the same as Gelliot's post. I wanted to give a little feedback based on my experience.

On my first attempt, I had tax receipts from 2005 through 2008. The receipts showed that I had paid taxes on an amount several times greater than what I wanted to exchange. However, the bank wouldn't use the old receipts.

I have used the Huangniu for several smaller transactions in the past so I thought about trying that route for this exchange. The Huangniu said that he could exchange the money but the bank would charge more to wire it out. (Something to do with a different rate for TT and DD?) He suggested getting a Chinese friend to handle to conversion.

I did go back a second time armed with all of the tax receipts for 2009. I only exchanged about 1/3 of my annual income but they stamped each one of my 2009 tax receipts as 'used for exchange'.

Initially the bank also wanted to see 2010 tax receipts as well but I told them our HR hadn't given them to me yet. I aslo pointed out that the actual tax bill that I paid in 2009 was greater than the amount that I was trying to wire out.

ICBC can exchange money on the weekends but can only process wire transfers during the week. I think the also have to be processed by 2 or 3 pm but I don't recall the exact time.

I do agree that the process can vary from day to day and person to person. I think a lot of it has to do with how lucky you are handling the odd requests that the might come up during the process. It can go pretty smoothly as along as you go prepared to show a lot of paper work.
User avatar
chingy
Seeker
Seeker
 
Posts: 63
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 9:27 am

Next

Return to Legal Issues

 


  • Related topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests