is this moment of touch or out of patriotism?

by **yinlin** » Thu May 22, 2008 6:27 pm

i have seen a lot of touching story in the past one weeks after the earthquake in Sichuan. Quite a significant of Chinese have expressed their patriotism in various ways trying to help the casualties and people suffering this Sichuan quake. But my question is do you think this is just a moment of touch or people DO feel the pain as the victims in sichuan?

I have seen a lot of criticism on wealth/ famous people not donating/ contributing enough in this sichuan quake. I am on the same line with criticizer at this instance as i always believe giving is always better than receiving. But what is the percentage of people would really try to fold out their affordable donation (say at least 1/10 of their monthly salary) to the victims? I had a fund raising activity for sichuan quake in my own company with 13 permanent employees (average monthly pay is around RMB 6000) and promised that i would donate the same amount that match their total donation. Of course, i gave my promise to them before the fundraising activity that our donation to red cross china would be transparent in order to gain their trust. The campaign last for 3 working days and the total amount was really laughable which made me "breaking" my promise to donate 8 times of their total contribution. I still can see some of their msn signature is still all about their sympathy to sichuan casualties and i wonder whether this is the case applicable to the majority of Chinese people- morale support is more essential than financial support in this disaster to casualties?

* don't tell me that most people here are too shy to donate in public fundraising activity

by **kuldaen** » Thu May 22, 2008 6:58 pm

People should give what they feel they should give. who are you to say that they should give money. Its not a matter of shyness, financial situation or anything its a personal thing. if you give great. but don't try to judge other people for their action or inactions. You don't really know their circumstances, reasons or rationales or even if they have any of those. but then its not really anyone's business but their own.

Personally even giving 1 Kuai is NOT a laughable amount.

by **ymm** » Thu May 22, 2008 6:58 pm

Some people donate several times in different places, as I know. Red cross, company activity, charity, community......

by **wizzard** » Thu May 22, 2008 7:43 pm

kuldaen, you are a reasonable man. while"average monthly pay is around RMB 6000" is a "homeless" salary in Shanghai, so they are still building their own homes here, much hard works to do as well

by **yinlin** » Fri May 23, 2008 4:58 pm

i am not trying to judge people with amount of donation they made but don't shout too loud or cry as if you just lost your love ones when you read the news. That is just moment of touch, not wrong but it just makes me sick that you are not even helping to the people that you think they deserve the most help from all over the world at this moment. Am i the only one who thinks this way? Probably i need a mental doctor

by **yu888** » Fri May 23, 2008 5:09 pm

One must be able to support oneself before they can help others. It is not up to us how much they opt to donate. Everyone has their own priorities. The fact that you stand on the side of those gossiping ayi-types talking about which celebrity donated what indicates to me that your perspective is not one that understands individuality as much as many expats do. So be it, everyone can believe what they want.

by **yinlin** » Fri May 23, 2008 5:30 pm

One must be able to support oneself before they can help others

fully agree but if you don't even willing to spend even 20% to 30% of your monthly DISPENSABLE CASH to the people you think that deserve all sympathy at this moment, why shouting that loud when you heard about the celebrity donation amount?
again, i am not judging people on the amount they donate as it is down to his/ her affordable level. And i just think those who really sacrifice part of his time/ dispensable cash to help those casulties deserve more respect than we do.
of course, i am not grouping people like me to attack on chinese/ expat in china who do not contribute enough in this disaster but i just want to express my own opinion on this issue.

by **yu888** » Fri May 23, 2008 5:48 pm

disposable income for different employees and collegues is different. Unless one know all about their current cash needs, sick relatives, school debts, child in jail or hospital, paying alimony/child support, ridiculous housing payments etc... there really is no way for anyone to reasonably make that judgment call. It sounds more like you are emotional about it, like the rest of us...but don't let it cloud logic and judgment. Any little bit counts and everyone gives in their own way. Otherwise next thing you know some person will give their entire year's pay (or worse yet donate a mont';s salary that is equal to many of our salries combined ) and then make the judgment call that you are bad for only donating a month's pay...etc...

by **kuldaen** » Fri May 23, 2008 5:50 pm

yinlin wrote: i am not judging people on the amount they donate as it is down to his/ her affordable level.

yinlin wrote:And i just think those who really sacrifice part of his time/ dispensable cash to help those casulties deserve more respect than we do.

These two statments are totally opposite. By saying the second one you are judging people. I don't really agree with you here.

I would really respect anyone who gives even just 1 kuai as much as someone who puts in 1million. The thing is not how much you put in. its that you do. if everyone in this city put in 1 kuai it would be 20million kuai.

by **Megs** » Fri May 23, 2008 6:19 pm

Who cares how much people give? It's not a competition! The amount of money you donate is not directly proportional to how much you care! If that's the case, the larger corporations care more than the lot of us, and I sincerely doubt that!

Every little bit helps, and I agree with Kuldaen, even a 1RMB donation is nothing to scoff at, especially when you don't know the circumstances of the individual donating.

by **canuckian** » Fri May 23, 2008 6:35 pm

I went to this club where supposedly an 'event' was held to support the quake victims. The club claimed all the proceeds that night would go into donations. I didn't give a cent. I mean, why would I need a night club to channel out my money for the quake victims? I'd rather donate the money directly to many of the available non-profit organizations out there such as the red-cross & International SOS.
Funny thing is, there was this drunken dude donated 2,000RMB right on the stage in front of everybody. The MC announced the donation and people applauded him. You see, there are many loaded people in Shanghai, but when they donate money, it isn't necessarily for the victim's cause. It's all for their own vanity.

by **sbergman** » Fri May 23, 2008 6:48 pm

I've made my donations but I have also wondered whether the role of a communist/socialist government is different than the role of other governments when it comes to these sorts of things. Should this be a private charitable event or should rebuilding these people's lives be primarily a government responsibility - at least for the funding, with organized opportunities for people to provide their labor? I think it's great that NGOs are getting more involved in China because I think that it will also encourage more empathy and generosity but part of me thinks that it's not in keeping with the governmental system.

Part of the tragedy of Katrina was wrought because it happened under a leadership that believes that it is the role of the private sector, not the government, to provide aid. And, in the end, it was the private sector that stepped in. I had neighbors renting trucks to deliver water and clothes. But, is that what China wants?

(I am not suggesting that other countries not provide aid - especially expertise and equipment.)

by **yinlin** » Fri May 23, 2008 7:52 pm

Yu- i know what you are saying but it just makes me so sick to see people pointing their fingers at celebrity/ wealthy entepreneurs for donating too little and yet they refuse to offer little more help they could easily afford.

Kuldaen- if you are making speech in a slum, i would give you a big hand. In perfect world, your concept is beautiful. If there was only 20 million from Shanghai to Sichuan quake, it might take 100 years for them to rebuild.

by **Quack** » Fri May 23, 2008 9:31 pm

But remind you that China has 1.3 billion people, if everyone donates 1RMB, it would be 1.3billion RMB.

by **Quack** » Fri May 23, 2008 9:34 pm

And donation is not only about money, probably your employees donated blood, food, or other ways of help. You just dont know.

by **SnappySammy** » Fri May 23, 2008 10:23 pm

sbergman wrote:I've made my donations but I have also wondered whether the role of a communist/socialist government is different than the role of other governments when it comes to these sorts of things. Should this be a private charitable event or should rebuilding these people's lives be primarily a government responsibility - at least for the funding, with organized opportunities for people to provide their labor? I think it's great that NGOs are getting more involved in China because I think that it will also encourage more empathy and generosity but part of me thinks that it's not in keeping with the governmental system.

Part of the tragedy of Katrina was wrought because it happened under a leadership that believes that it is the role of the private sector, not the government, to provide aid. And, in the end, it was the private sector that stepped in. I had neighbors renting trucks to deliver water and clothes. But, is that what China wants?

I don't want to say to much. If you have a company in China that makes a product that could be used for helping the recovery. You already have been told what and how much you should give.

(I am not suggesting that other countries not provide aid - especially expertise and equipment.)

by **massiv** » Fri May 23, 2008 10:36 pm

I have donated 5 months of my annual salary...it is called taxes.

by **yu888** » Sat May 24, 2008 12:37 am

yinlin wrote:Yu- i know what you are saying but it just makes me so sick to see people pointing their fingers at celebrity/ wealthy entepreneurs for donating too little and yet they refuse to offer little more help they could easily afford.

Kuldaen- if you are making speech in a slum, i would give you a big hand. In perfect world, your concept is beautiful. If there was only 20 million from Shanghai to Sichuan quake, it might take 100 years for them to rebuild.

If you are so easliy "made sick" by the lack of generosity in this case, maybe you just have too much empathy and time on your hands. There are far more things in this world that you can make an actual difference at worrying about. Pick your battles... and donate more, or better yet, go out and help personally. hands on shanghai is taking applications for people who can donate their time and actually go out there to assist in rebuilding.

by **sbergman** » Sat May 24, 2008 8:19 am

I don't want to say to much. If you have a company in China that makes a product that could be used for helping the recovery. You already have been told what and how much you should give.

And maybe that's as it should be. The tax for being a capitalist in a communist country. Maybe not state-owned but, when necessary, still state-controlled, eh?

by **sbergman** » Sat May 24, 2008 11:39 am

What Journal would that be?

by **yinlin** » Sat May 24, 2008 12:47 pm

But remind you that China has 1.3 billion people, if everyone donates 1RMB, it would be 1.3billion RMB.

beautiful theory, you remind me there was once when i was still a kid that my dream was to be a beggar.

by **Beartrap** » Sat May 24, 2008 2:41 pm

Lack of generosity. They have tapped everybody phone telling them to donate! So much cash has flooded into Sichuan recently. After all the healing is over stories are going to start coming out about how some guys pocketed 3 million rmb during some money transfer! You see the bundles of cash just laying on the table in the middle of some run down government building!!!! Really need some international aid organizations taking a closer look at whats happening there to make sure all the cash is going to the right place...

by **sbergman** » Sat May 24, 2008 2:58 pm

Really need a denomination bigger than a 100.

by **canuckian** » Sat May 24, 2008 2:58 pm

Donations to China's quake-hit regions rose to 21.4 billion Chinese yuan (3.1 billion U.S. dollars), on May 22, 10 days after quake. Mobile phone users in China have donated nearly 100 million yuan using text messages; China Foundation for Poverty Alleviation (CFPA) has received donations totaling over 240 million yuan.

Over 70 countries making donations to quake-hit areas. International community's donations total 2 billion yuan ($ 288 million).

Relax... yinlin :wink:

by **kumlong** » Sun May 25, 2008 3:38 pm

yinlin, u are not a dumb guy. consider some things:

(1) donations are up to each individual and totally voluntary. this concept i think does not seem to click with a person of chinese ethnicity. they seem equate money with passion and patriotism

(2) accountability. dont donate blindly. ensure that your money will really reach those who need it. and ensure that the rebuilding is done to proper standards.

is this moment of touch or out of patriotism?

is this moment of touch or out of patriotism?

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