Billionaire investor George Soros is planning a property fund to invest in real estate projects in China and Hong Kong, 21st Century Business Herald reported.

Soros Fund Management LLC’s Hong Kong subsidiary SFM HK Management Ltd. started planning the real estate fund early this year, and Soros is meeting developers and agents in Hong Kong, the newspaper said today, without saying where it got the information. The fund’s clients include tycoons in China and Hong Kong, it said.

Some foreign investors are seeking opportunities in China’s slowing property market. CBRE Global Investors, manager of $94.8 billion of real estate assets, said yesterday it may make its first investment in the nation’s housing market in four years in anticipation the government will start easing its property curbs.

Soros’s fund may be a vehicle to finance Chinese developers, 21st Century said. Michael Vachon, a New York-based spokesman for Soros Fund Management and Hong Kong-based fund manager Dai Jixin of SFM HK Management declined to comment on the report.

The credit outlook of China’s real estate companies will become “increasingly severe” amid government efforts to curb rising home prices, Standard & Poor’s said in a report on Sept. 27. China this year raised the down-payment requirements and mortgage rates on some homes and imposed housing purchase restrictions in about 40 cities to help curb inflation and make housing more affordable.

China’s home prices retreated for a second month in October, according to SouFun Holdings Ltd., China’s biggest real estate website. In Hong Kong, home prices slid to the lowest in more than six months last week as the threat of an economic recession continues to dent buyer sentiment, Centaline Property Agency Ltd., the city’s biggest privately held realtor, said on Nov. 11.

Soros’s firm, which is based in New York and oversees about $25 billion in assets, held about $4.9 billion in stocks at the end of the quarter, according to the filing with the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission.

http://www.businessweek.com/news/2011-11-15/soros-plans-china-hong-kong-property-fund-21st-century-says.html

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we all know soros is a master of shortsale, while most of us know china's real estate is a bubble, but why does solos want to invest intead of sale?

his main purpose is to short the whole chinese economy instead of the real estate. but china's real estate bubble is still not so big that its burst will lead to the collapse of the whole economy. chinese government's policy in real estate prevent the bubble from growing up. so soros must invest more in the real estate to swell the bubble, to make sure that he can reap colossal profits from his gigantic money having deployed to short chinese economy.

palominocn wrote:chinese government's policy in real estate prevent the bubble from growing up.

Bubble? What bubble? There's no bubble is there?

Properties in Shanghai are overvalued by 100 to 200% using fundamental analysis. For a typical Shanghai apartment, let's say 3 years old, the value is approximately double what makes sense. That should give you some idea about the extent of the bubble.

Some markets can remain in a bubble for a long time when investors are irrationally optimistic about future prices. That is the condition in Shanghai. Irrational optimism.

I'm guessing that Soros sees serious weakness in some of those real estate development companies, and wants to buy into them at bargain basement prices. If so, he's acting more like Warren Buffet than a short-seller.

rickettyrabbit wrote:

palominocn wrote:chinese government's policy in real estate prevent the bubble from growing up.

Bubble? What bubble? There's no bubble is there?

Properties in Shanghai are overvalued by 100 to 200% using fundamental analysis. For a typical Shanghai apartment, let's say 3 years old, the value is approximately double what makes sense. That should give you some idea about the extent of the bubble.

the bubble's burst still can't lead to the collapse of the whole economy, and chinese government have vented some hot airs out of the bubble.

Some markets can remain in a bubble for a long time when investors are irrationally optimistic about future prices. That is the condition in Shanghai. Irrational optimism.

I'm guessing that Soros sees serious weakness in some of those real estate development companies, and wants to buy into them at bargain basement prices. If so, he's acting more like Warren Buffet than a short-seller.

solos want to invent in developers instead of real estate? plausible. but i think he maybe just want to prolong the bubble or swell another bigger bubble, so can short china easily in the future.

palominocn wrote:

rickettyrabbit wrote:

palominocn wrote:chinese government's policy in real estate prevent the bubble from growing up.

Bubble? What bubble? There's no bubble is there?

Properties in Shanghai are overvalued by 100 to 200% using fundamental analysis. For a typical Shanghai apartment, let's say 3 years old, the value is approximately double what makes sense. That should give you some idea about the extent of the bubble.

the bubble's burst still can't lead to the collapse of the whole economy, and chinese government have vented some hot airs out of the bubble.

Maybe you're right, and maybe you're wrong. You don't know that. Events like bubble collapses are too difficult to gauge ahead of time. Depending on what else happens because of it, it could hurt very badly.

Which banks do you think will fail if apartment prices drop by 50%? Do you have any idea? I don't think you've looked at any Chinese bank balance sheets lately.

rickettyrabbit wrote:Some markets can remain in a bubble for a long time when investors are irrationally optimistic about future prices. That is the condition in Shanghai. Irrational optimism.

I'm guessing that Soros sees serious weakness in some of those real estate development companies, and wants to buy into them at bargain basement prices. If so, he's acting more like Warren Buffet than a short-seller.

palominocn wrote:solos want to invent in developers instead of real estate? plausible. but i think he maybe just want to prolong the bubble or swell another bigger bubble, so can short china easily in the future.

I think he sees the weakness and wants to invest. As Buffet has said, the time to invest is when everyone is afraid and in despair. Maybe Soros is a little early. Palo's not afraid or in despair . . . yet.

Maybe you're right, and maybe you're wrong. You don't know that. Events like bubble collapses are too difficult to gauge ahead of time. Depending on what else happens because of it, it could hurt very badly.

Which banks do you think will fail if apartment prices drop by 50%? Do you have any idea? I don't think you've looked at any Chinese bank balance sheets lately.

as you have said it's diffcult to predict the time of burst, it's also difficult to measure the bigness of the bubble. i know there is a report saying chinese banks can't remain healthy if the price will drop by 50%, but the probability of the apartment price dropping by 50% is nearly zero. a newly developed residence area in shanghai was sold off in a week after the price was cut off by 20%. Soros feels uneasy that the bubble is still not too big to make the property market avalanche. so he wants to add some fuel to the market.

I think he sees the weakness and wants to invest. As Buffet has said, the time to invest is when everyone is afraid and in despair. Maybe Soros is a little early. Palo's not afraid or in despair . . . yet.

there is a chinese saying: dog can't change the habit of eating sh1t. i don't think Soros will change to invest in his 80's, his final purpose is to shortsale.

palominocn wrote:

Maybe you're right, and maybe you're wrong. You don't know that. Events like bubble collapses are too difficult to gauge ahead of time. Depending on what else happens because of it, it could hurt very badly.

Which banks do you think will fail if apartment prices drop by 50%? Do you have any idea? I don't think you've looked at any Chinese bank balance sheets lately.

as you have said it's diffcult to predict the time of burst, it's also difficult to measure the bigness of the bubble. i know there is a report saying chinese banks can't remain healthy if the price will drop by 50%, but the probability of the apartment price dropping by 50% is nearly zero. a newly developed residence area in shanghai was sold off in a week after the price was cut off by 20%. Soros feels uneasy that the bubble is still not too big to make the property market avalanche. so he wants to add some fuel to the market.

Nearly zero?

Why? One reason - Chinese don't BELIEVE prices can go down that much. That's because most have never been through a major bubble. Once bitten, twice shy.

I think he sees the weakness and wants to invest. As Buffet has said, the time to invest is when everyone is afraid and in despair. Maybe Soros is a little early. Palo's not afraid or in despair . . . yet.

palominocn wrote:there is a chinese saying: dog can't change the habit of eating sh1t. i don't think Soros will change to invest in his 80's, his final purpose is to shortsale.

And a leopard can't change its spots, too, right?

These sayings are "metaphors". They pretend to be parallels to real life, but they are not. People become prisoners of their metaphors.

Stop thinking in metaphors and describe the real world as it is. Metaphors will always lead you astray.

compare the property price of beijing with tokyo soeul taipai

And?

palominocn wrote:compare the property price of beijing with tokyo soeul taipai

Doh. The cities you mentioned are actually civilized metropolises where you dont step on shiat when you go out to buy a popsicle. They are clean, efficient, have functioning normal human beings living in them.

Let's not even talk about between the relationship of income and the price of an apartment, which basically shreds any credibility your "thoughts" might have had.

Beijing is a polluted mess, it's a cancer pit full of yokels bumping into each other while spitting TB infested phlegm everywhere. The fact you to think a are comparing any chinese city with anything else just makes it pretty clear you never took your sorry ass out of the frontiers of china i.e. you have a lot of opinions about a lot of things you know nothing about.

Like Andreas says: the dangerous mixture between ignorance and arrogance, china's favorite cocktail!

George Soros is well know currensies speculant, but finally he become nice guy and come to China for spreading goodness.

If i remember correctly, due "the Crysis" Cn Govt. helped property market with 500 Billions of dollars
what caused home prices was mostly doubled.

If Soros can add the same value - prices will triple (counting from 2008).

In result probaly will caused Bloody Revolution, good old Chinese revolution wich will
WIPE CHINA FROM THE WORLD MAP FOR ANOTHER 50 -100 YEARS.

America will kept own dominance.
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500 BILLIONS OF DOLLARS - is not that big price for THE DEAL, right, Soros ?

If I read the opportunity correctly, Soros has a good chance to bail out the development companies, keep them alive during this bad period, then sell them when the development business in China recovers. That way, he's not exposed to the Chinese property market directly, but benefits greatly when it goes up.

I think that would be a good play for someone with Soros' money.

DoReMe wrote:George Soros is well know currensies speculant, but finally he become nice guy and come to China for spreading goodness.

If i remember correctly, due "the Crysis" Cn Govt. helped property market with 500 Billions of dollars
what caused home prices was mostly doubled.

If Soros can add the same value - prices will triple (counting from 2008).

In result probaly will caused Bloody Revolution, good old Chinese revolution wich will
WIPE CHINA FROM THE WORLD MAP FOR ANOTHER 50 -100 YEARS.

America will kept own dominance.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

500 BILLIONS OF DOLLARS - is not that big price for THE DEAL, right, Soros ?

you underestimate my impact . i just need 5 billion . the money following me willexceed 500 billion
---------from soros to RB







you underestimate my impact. i just need 5 billion. the money following will exceed

wipe the country from the map from 50 years , interesting

Palo, "they coming .. "

Here i will write some BS. (It's stated especially for Tyler, who, in same case, will not allowed to use word "BS", because that will violated my copyrights @).

I has read a lot of such great investors like Buffet, Soros, etc ... and i ever wondering they

how can predict the future of financial companies, markets, government's plans ? Really, HOW ?!!

Crystal Balls, Coffee Grounds, Time Machine .. ?

FoxNews will answer: YES,YES,YEEES ! It's American Dream !
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But i think what these great investors are just "pockets-managers" of political-economical Elites,

and, of course, they takes insiders information Just-In-Time, directly from the "clique of auctioneers".

Sounds like BS ? - Probably yes.

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But if that is rights, Soros is a puppet of Elite and SHOULD follow all their orders, so .. go figure..



PS: I tried Google search for Soros Insider, it gives a lot of "suggestions"...hmm.. why ?

Such result for Buffett Insider ... - it's all haters !

Mates, call to Sergey Brin and let him correct that BS, wtf...